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Att: Houndsmen in the West, Get SMART

Posted: Fri Jul 05, 2013 2:41 pm
by Dads dogboy
Fellows I have read with interest all the challenges you all in CA, OR, and WA have with your Politicians and Wildlife Resource Agencies. What you all have had to face and the measures you have used to try and Stop or reverse the infringements on your "Privileges" to use the Outdoors.


We have now met many of you and talked with you and heard your frustrations and dedications to regain or keep these "Privileges".....Privileges not RIGHTS!

You all spend way too much time arguing and fighting amongst yourselves to ever get any thing done!

You fellows do not need to reinvent the wheel....other States have faced the same issues you are now dealing with and the Houndsmen have prevailed! Instead of bickering and bitching at each other, take a close look at what WI & NM did to get to keep Hounds envolved in the Management of Bear, Lion and Bobcat. Get a hold of Cat and Bear or one of the others in WI, or George Hobbs in NM and start using the tools that they used to defeat the Liberal Politicians and Anti Hunters in their States.

In OR, I hear one Female State Senator stopped the latest Bill from coming to a Vote....Well following the WI model, I would put an extensive Back Ground investigation into her Past, and start a campaign to unseat her. That is two ways to get her to go away or to reevaluate her position the next time the Bill hits her Committee.

Next you folks need to be Pro- Active in winning the War of the Media. I preached this to the CA Folks but they were too "Little too Late" to do any good! The Folks on the East Coast fight this battle each Legislative Session with the Antis trying to close the Fox Pens. Yet the Antis end up butting their heads against a "Wall of Good Will" as the Houndsmen and Pen Owners and Fox Hound Clubs have held Benefit Hunts (Field Trials) for Charity causes ranging from aiding Churches, FFA and other Youth Groups, Families who have lost homes to Storms or Fires, Wounded Warriors, and many more Worthwhile Causes!

Each time one of the above described events takes place the Organizers have the local Politicos, TV, Radio Stations and Newspapers there. It becomes hard to Vote against a Bill when your Picture and Video Clips are showing you shaking Hands, kissing Babies, and eating Catfish with several hundred or your Constituents enjoying what that Bill would KILL!

The Outside Hunters of all legal Game and the Pen Hunters on the East Coast have put aside their differences and focused on the things that they share to Unite to fight the Good Fight....and Fight it Smartly in the SAME manner that the Antis use against them. That is SMART use of the MEDIA to reach the Masses, while endearing and tying the Politicos to their Constituents.

You all in the West had better get SMART, call these States Houndsmen, use what has worked or soon you will be out of the Hound Hunting Business!

Re: Att: Houndsmen in the West, Get SMART

Posted: Sat Jul 06, 2013 12:29 am
by not color blind
You are right on.

In all seriousness, instead of 'stroking' each other with the 'great cat hunters gathering' (and I'm sure its a ton of work for the guys that set it up). Wouldn't you all in the west be a lot better off getting something going like Mr. Clay is talking about. Maybe starting with having a gathering/fund raiser to FIGHT for your rights as Houndsmen and building from there?

The only way your gonna get anywhere is politicians on your side. & Money and votes is the only way to get a politician on your side (it's sucks to say it but its the truth).

Re: Att: Houndsmen in the West, Get SMART

Posted: Sat Jul 06, 2013 1:46 am
by al baldwin
True would help if all hound hunters could agree & work as one, however, after 20 years of trying to gain back hunting thru politicians don/t believe that's going to happen. Doubt if a vote of the Oregon voters will go in our favor, but if the public could see what took the place of hound, ( up close ) it might sway things in favor of the hounds. The ballot measure that ending hounds being used to hunt bear & cougar passed by a small margin & the antis used videos that were filmed out of state to show how unethical hound hunting can be. It/s tough to have Dewey state we hunters caused measure 18 to pass. I know for sure there was a lot of hunters in this area who worked hard to defeat measure 18. Its not like some did not try, just could not match the antis funds. Also know several hunters who belonged to the Coquille Valley Houndsmen traveled to Salem to bring the spring bear hunts back. Regardless believe it best to remember the ranchers did not pass 18, so in my opinion hounds men will not gain anything, refusing to help if they ask. Al

Re: Att: Houndsmen in the West, Get SMART

Posted: Sat Jul 06, 2013 2:12 am
by mark
not color blind wrote:You are right on.

In all seriousness, instead of 'stroking' each other with the 'great cat hunters gathering' (and I'm sure its a ton of work for the guys that set it up). Wouldn't you all in the west be a lot better off getting something going like Mr. Clay is talking about. Maybe starting with having a gathering/fund raiser to FIGHT for your rights as Houndsmen and building from there?

The only way your gonna get anywhere is politicians on your side. & Money and votes is the only way to get a politician on your side (it's sucks to say it but its the truth).



"STROKE" us with some of your infinite wisdom and tell us where the money that was raised at the gathering was sent to.

Re: Att: Houndsmen in the West, Get SMART

Posted: Sat Jul 06, 2013 2:02 pm
by LarryBeggs
I think in the long run the only way we can win this fight is to a attack the ideals that are being taught to our kids. Number one being that government should control every aspect of our lives. And then we wont have to work for anything. I sure don't know how to do that. Maybe we need to raise our kids up to be teachers, and politicians . And turn the next generation to our way of thinking.

In the short run though if we want to see our grandkids get to do the things our kids missed out on. We have to try and change the minds of the generation that is already voting. In Oregon we need the city people on our side to win anything. The current way of doing things goes against there way of thinking. Our way is more humane and ethical and they don't have to pay for it. Shouldn't be that hard of a sell. Because it is the truth. we lost this through a ballet measure. We need to win it back in a ballet measure. We cant win thru the crooked legislature catering to HSUS lobbyist . We can change the minds of there voter base on this issue. But the State senate I don't think there is any hope for . I don't think there voter base will vote them out because there are to many other issues they agree with them on. But those are other battles. The people in Oregon need to see the graphic facts about what they are paying for. With the politicians it is all about money,funding there agenda and retaining there power. I think most people want to do what is right. But don't really know the truth about what is going on. We need to show it to them!!! Take care, Larry

Re: Att: Houndsmen in the West, Get SMART

Posted: Sat Jul 06, 2013 6:51 pm
by mike martell
C John

When you see our sport hunter groups aligned against all of us hound hunters, coupled with the fact that Oregon is a majority liberal Democrat State and the Oregon Legislature is controlled by liberal Democrats, the only remaining option we have in our war chest is called the truth!

Exposing the truth cost little more than ramming it down the throats of all the politicians in the legislature that just couldn't wait to pass by a 100% margin, H.B. 2390A the Government agent bill. When you look at the facts, it is fundamentally basic. Every piece of legislation related to Government has passed by a wide margin in favor.

C John, You do know that Jackie Dingfelder single handily stalled and killed our hound legislation but her and the same 16 Senate Democrats voted by 100% to pass the Government agent bill?

I have been called wrong on this and it appears a majority (Now at 99%) agree after seeing an inherent pattern aimed direct at Government. We blew our chance by allowing our lobby to sit back and not so much as call time out so we can compare what replaced our hounds for both bear and cougar to the current prescribed methods.

This is not complicated and will be changed, simply level the playing field by bringing the snares and Government to a halt! These pin heads can't figure our we are serious, go after all Federal Funding and END it as well!

I said it on another thread and I will repeat myself one more time....You disagree with this analogy, put up your plan, log on and explain to the 99% how we are wrong and how you intend to change this pattern. We are waiting patiently, when you set forth a plan that the 99% can see will work, we are on all board!

Mike Martell
Exposure to the truth will set Government free.

Re: Att: Houndsmen in the West, Get SMART

Posted: Sat Jul 06, 2013 7:10 pm
by Dads dogboy
Mr. Mike,

I have heard you all!

I have read with interest all you all have done for the last several years.

I have heard different Groups and Individuals throw each other under the Bus!

You all have not made much PROGRESS!

I have not got a dog in your Hunt so to speak! Yet I have given you all what I feel is good
ADVISE. Get with Folks in WI, VA, NC and SC and see how they are winning the battles you all are LOOSING!

Any one out there..... Mr. Mike, Mr. Dale, Mr. Dewey or any other person may call and I will be glad to direct you to Folks who are finding ways to beat the Antis at their own game!

To Quote Floridacathunter "I'll hush Know"!

Re: Att: Houndsmen in the West, Get SMART

Posted: Sat Jul 06, 2013 9:41 pm
by mike martell
C John

We aren't like any state in the Nation and I doubt what other States are doing or have done will help much. We have an image problem and nothing more and current passed legislation supports this claim.

Here is my example. Wife catches husband cheating and decides to have an affair of her own, the man(All Oregon Houndsmen) are remorseful for the actions and cleans up our act and the wife (ODFW)continues to have daily affairs with different men that goes on for years and she just can't seem to find it in her heart to forgive her man, but demonstrates behavior that is five hundred times worse than that of her husband and the wife is Ron Anglin with Odfw....Government justifying the love affair with more Government....