Ousda members and or residents acting as "agents" sound off

[1bludawg]

[1bludawg]

I can understand why they do it but they hurt us all by doing it !!!

[Dale T]

[mike martell]

Does anyone think this crap would continue if the simple truth had been exposed during the hearings? This is exactly why the question was never raised. How well did the clubbing/ dumping of steelhead go over on the Alsea river years ago? We would be hunting right now if we only had representation that understood hounds and hunting.

OOC is clueless. They have no clue what an Aldrich ankle catch snare looks like or how it works for bear or the question would have been raised during the hearings. OOC stated we would lose our mid term trapping initiative if we involved the snare. This is the most ignorant thing I have ever listened to? The same folks think a cougar is a predator in Oregon? Please reference our big game synopsis for a quick review to determine what the difference is between a predator and a big game mammal.

How can a snare designed to work by a spring loaded throw arm attached to a cable tied to a tree set over a rank beef head have anything to do with a steel jaw trap? All OOC consist of between Jerod Broadfoot and Wayne Endicott is two jelly donut archery bait hunters that don't understand hounds. They opted to cling to baiting bears when there own polling indicated it would lead to what happened and they allowed bear hunting with hounds to also be extracted for the same reasons. If you understand the difference, this would have been an easy position to defend.

Endicott truly is clueless for aiding a hound hunter friend and happens to be one who is permitted under ODFW while being the master mind behind OOC.....Can we say conflict of interest? Once more you simply call bullshit where it needs to be called! Why did OHA dump OOC recently? You figure it out! 10,000 members strong. They did however patch things up.

To defend any situation from a professional stand point, one must first know how to speak the language. Why do you never hire a divorce lawyer to represent you in a murder trial? I think OOC is indeed the best thing to happen for our rights if we had someone driving the bus that had a driver license. Before you all jump down my throat, please reread the last paragraph....

They still remain better than nothing, but given the way they do things, it ain't much better than nothing....This is so simple a cave man could figure it out...Challenge the antics of Government. Force the question. Oregon is broke and we have a budget to fund Government snares on corporate lands, we were condemned for select harvesting over hounds and Government labels the baby cubs as unknowns and can hire government to eradicate cougar and haul those same cougar killed over the same style hounds as were banned to the landfill to be dumped.....Sadly, if you can't make a case, you really are a divorce lawyer at a murder trial.....

[jcathunter]

I agree, Mike and this is why we need hound hunter representation within OOC. Wayne has agreed to cease doing damage work for cougars because he now knows that its not looked upon favorably by the hound community and why we do not. OOC needs hound hunter support to maintain credibility so lets get involved and show them what we need. I am working on putting together a meeting of as many groups representing hunters in the northwest as possible. This meeting will allow us to speak up and choose our representation.

[mike martell]

Jason.
I make a strong and harsh argument that can and will be spun out of context. I have been very clear over the years....You simply can't have a dog in the hunt and be able to judge the cast! If OOC is to remain our voice....

1. Endicott needs to terminate his role as agent!

2. OOC needs to have a person who knows what the hell is going on and how to combat the enemy!

3. ODFW hates our guts with a passion or at least upper end management does. I defend most field personnel who are kept like mushrooms in the dark and fed bullshit!

4. This is so damn simple. Ronny Anglin looks like Obama after the election, his look says, did I really get reelected? Did I just pull the wool over all the peoples eyes? Amazing how this could happen!

We need to organize OOC and get them on track to know how to fight to win....If you find yourself engaged in a fair fight, your tactics suck! How did we lose this battle? Learn from those who wrote the book and use the same methods they used on us. No rules of engagement, just Taliban tactics.

Let me be very clear. We need OOC to step up and represent all of us and the intent of my previous comment was to define where they are going wrong! We don't need to toss them under the bus, nor does oha.... We need figure out, we will lose more ground if we divide our interest. If you place your hands over your eyes, you will get rope a doped to death.

Mike

[oregon perk]

Hey Jason,I was an agent for the state but was never used I do work for private land owners for bear and couger.The only reason I do couger is because I'm tired of seeing my friends and neighbors animals being killed and no one doing anything about it and at the same time letting everyone know what is going on with the state and USDA.Jason you know I did the WA thing,but work in OR now I do not snare and will never snare I know I am showing that hounds are better than indiscrimently slaughtering our animals.I may not always agree with Dewey but I think I'm doing good PR by showing houndhunters in a positive way.The people we should have an issue with are the ones being paid by the state or Gov. and killing as many cougers as they can.I have been at the capitol many times talking to are Senators and Reps.and letting them know what is really going on.I know if we do not expose the truth to as many people as we can we will loose more hunting in the future.

[mike martell]

Time for a time out!
We sound like the GOP!

None of us can believe this is happening to all of us. We will once more unite and defeat liberalism. I made the statement to USDA Aphis Wildlife Services head, David Williams three years ago, he needs to return to what his original job description was and that is trapping predators and doing real stock damage etc, not work funded by our dollars to eradicate black bears on privately owned timber company grounds or engage in the landfilling of cougar across Oregon. Evidently Government intends to stay the course.

Both Williams and Anglin know only then will I go away, until then, they remain fair game. This is not complicated and if we can't bring all the sport hunters to the front lines, than I suspect the liberal base in Portland will end up defeating ODFW and USDA and they can turn both brick building into shrines of the past! Either way it goes, we are not going to be hunting in Oregon, so why should we fund these programs?

I also suspect by now OOC knows where they went wrong and are heading towards recovery. The meeting between hound hunters and OOC should include OHA, ODFW and USDA as well. I still think both Government agencies are going to topple if they keep there heads firmly buried in the sand....

[Dale T]

As far as myself, I may not agree with everybody's opinion on who or what is hurting us or working for us but that that doesn't mean that I'm against anybody that does not agree with me, it's just my opinion of the situation no more no less, we can not let a difference in opinions divide us, this fight for our rights is bigger than all of our opinions.

[mike martell]

Dale

You are right!

Let me shed some light on Oregon. You have USDA Agents who get paid to hunt and kill, next, you have volunteer agents who either give their time or some that get paid to hunt and kill animals. These guys have been vetted and passed a background check. Then you have guys like myself, no vetting, ODFW could care less if you have a dui, drug conviction as long as you can kill shit, they don't care! I started under a landowner who had problems long before 1994 and our ban. What you need to understand is what my position is pertaining to damage control in Oregon.

In a correspondence between myself and Administrator Anglin I discovered something of interest and alarming all at the same time. Anglin stated in an e-mail and many of you guys have this copy in hand and can verify the accuracy. Anglin writes, Mike, your request for damage and those involved is something ODFW has no idea or cares when it comes to landowner damage control? ......Really? So here is my position. ODFW is giving permits out like candy at a parade and has no clue who is doing the management nor do they care? I have brought up the whole management issue. Is this management or eradication? How do you know when harvest objectives have been reached or do you care?

This is out of control and the reason you have few bears left in our south Santiam drainage. I understand some folks will disagree and will object to this claim of vast locked areas that continue to breed future animals. Here is the problem in the black bear world. You can't keep killing your sows and cubs. Look at the facts! Sow Bears don't become of breeding age much before five years of age. Now tell me you can sustain a proper balance under this prescription? You can't and population curves would indicate this to be accurate if they were followed.

Last year between two contractors just in my home drainage who get paid directly by the timber producers, whacked fifty bears between them and no management objective criteria requirements? Now here is my prediction, If I request under the FOIA the harvest from last spring, I bet the farm there has been a fifty percent reduction in bears harvested. I bet this year was pretty lean for kills as well. Folks, I beg the question, is this proper management? No! ODFW continually claims to have their hands tied. The Oregon State legislature untied them a few years back, I suspect for fear of the general public knowing the truth, ODFW continues down the same path to total decimation and eradication of our valued resources with little or no regard for the end results.

We need to reevaluate this whole agent thing, as I type this and it is read by our viewers, some of the straight bobcat guys are thinking, it is pretty cool to no longer have hardly any bear issues above Sweet Home....... Management? Not hardly. We are killing way more bear and cougar than prior to the ban and if we don't get this whole management thing under control and reign in ODFW.....It is over for our game in Oregon. This is our problem when it comes to OOC. By no fault of there own, they simply do not understand bears, cougar and hounds...And most that do are driven by the dollar bill that is about to make there wallet a little thicker.

When you have the number one largest paid snare contractor in Oregon stumping for our rights as hound hunters and also happens to be the president of the Trapper Association and stands to lose nothing. Possibly does the guy really care deep inside? Here is more food for thought, I'm just one of those guys as well. you see, this has no bearing on myself either. I know that is not the case with the Trapper confirmed by one of our viewers that knows the guy, but it does make for pretty good speculation and the why change this situation. I have secured over the last two and one half decades a pretty sweet deal for myself that doesn't include you and that is why I fight like I do! Go ahead and knock me if you feel the need. I know bears and cougars and a little about the behavior and management.

We need to get the truth exposed if it means shutting the entire State down until we reach a reasonable resolution, Like our health care, Government is not the solution, Government is the problem. If you continue to snow and sell a bill of goods to a bunch of pin headed politicians, I suspect you will end up right where we are today in Oregon! simply stated, if we keep following down the same path for much longer, it is over for Oregon and I suspect it is to late in some GMU areas....

Mike Martell

[bluedogs]

mike don't you do damage control work for bears ??

I have a wildlife control buiss.. so far I have not gottin a call about lions if I did I would have to contact odfw and get permits to trap but would I yes and I would charge a lot but then again I got mouths to feed that's the only reason I would do it.

[mike martell]

Bluedogs.

Yes, I do damage control for bears in S.W. Oregon and have now going on my 26th year. I have a location consisting of crops and fall black bears. Prior to the ban this was a cool location, I hazed bears and allowed sport hunters wanting a nice fall boar to kill the culprits as needed, only done with select harvesting practices. Now I volunteer as a landowner agent and the only thing that is required of me is physical damage on premise to obtain a permit. ODFW does not care who you are or if you are a crack dealer..... Here is how and why I started making an issue of this situation....I load up and drive 150 miles to go past your driveway, house and hound dog kennels and continue another 40 miles to a location that only myself has permission to hunt on.

I have stated many times, this is wrong! I'm not on a state list nor would ODFW have me on one....I buck ODFW all the time. I can set barrel traps, baits, snares and lure bears for miles and slaughter them all, just like USDA, Contractors. No limits or overharvesting concerns, just kill em all mentality, I call bullshit on Odfw....I do things my way, screw these idiots! I use my dogs to sort the bears like livestock, I feel I can better afford to feed one dominant boar that kicks all other boars out of his domain, if that makes sense? As long as feed is abundant, boars will tolerate each other to a degree. Sometimes I have five boars feeding in one small location. I liked hazing the best, it allowed me to create a diversion until the fruit is harvested and once completed, the bear can have the remaining reject fruit....

I can only use my hounds on the property and any private ownership I have written permission to access. I have a timber producer that is under the impression that any bear that eats fruit also peels port Orford cedar trees in the spring, if I start a bear on the crop side and take it to the timber side it must walk legally. I think of this just like a bank robbery, the crops are the bank vault and I'm the cop chasing the robber across town to a dead end street and where I end it does not or should not matter, I should be able to kill it legally, but I can't! This is the most ignorant thing I have ever seen in my life.

Keep in mind I can set baits and snares and draw a bear from 25 miles away that have never touched a single piece of fruit to a location and kill 100% of these bears so long as a pile of bear poop is on location. Here is my grievance pertaining to timber, once one tree is peeled, it is open season for what the timber producer openly references as preventative maintenance. Just like doing crop damage, hounds take a bear off the peeled tree and if done correctly, you will never kill the wrong bear that peeled a tree if hounds are used. You can't make this claim with the use of snares.

Here is another fact! In my earlier claim of a fifty percent reduction on timber lands that I monitor the harvest, I was off by 15% or a reduction of 35% over the previous year since preventative maintenance is allowed on timber lands by Odfw. I suspect I would have been spot on, but found Odfw has a recording problem and never listed one baby cub on my list obtained just this week from Odfw after I horranged them to death over calling a baby cub an unknown and dumping them as they cling to the snared sows....I made my prediction at the beginning of this post and now that my reports are in hand, case closed, these idiots are guilty as charged! Now according to the law, I can't even haze a bear off the ownership to public access ground and be legal. Once the bear hits public ground, I'm in violation of the law and will be cited for illegally using a hound to pursue bears.

I work under the direction of Central Point ODFW where Mark Vargas heads this regional office and my biologist is a very nice lady named Rosemary Stussy. Odfw has no clue how management and control should work nor do they care. My other biologist John Thiebs retired around 1997 and Rosemary replaced him. She went one time with Ted Craddock and placed a tracking collar on a cougar, so like many biologist with Odfw, they are clueless, but like I say, they did however stay at a holiday inn and when it comes to bears and bear behavior,clueless. I have made the offer since day one to have her attend live field work studies, but to date, she has declined. I had hoped I could educate her and Odfw where snares, hounds and management are concerned. Properly done with the use of hounds over 25 years has never produced one single sow black bear killed on the ownership since those dominant boars are only there to eat and not breed so the ladies are rejected.....

Odfw says I lie about my findings but refuse my offer of doing live field work, as for the studies mentioned by Dewey to learn about bears or cougars to advance knowledge to gain our hound hunting rights back is just 100% bullshit....Ted Craddock spent several years collaring cougar in N.E. Oregon and then went back and killed all of them for ODFW as part of the landfill plan. Once Odfw established the data and determined how many deer and elk cougar killed, they were all killed because of pressure applied by OHA. ...Provisions have been in place for Odfw to use all of us sport hunters but they have rejected us....

Happy Fourth of July! Mike

[jcathunter]

In my talks with OHA members and reading their magazine, it is quite apparent to me that they want all cougars dead at all cost no matter who kills them.