Anything to pass the time

[perk]

Anybody got any recent success or failure stories you wanna share? dog you wanna brag in or curse about? Got any pups coming in your starting or excited to start? Anything to pass the time been kinda slow in this section lately. Happy hunting
perk

[lawdawgharris]

Nah in response to your question, we got to make a hunt yesterday. I’m a Texas hog hunter of course but I think this pertains to dogs of every discipline. I have a family of dogs that are catahoula and treeing Walker. Depending on the mating as to how much of each they actually carry. Anyway, I’ve been thinking it might be time to put a little hound back in them. They show the hound in appearance but some matings are producing more cur type hunting traits than I care for. I recently was given a 1year old brother and sister pair out of of a treeing Walker male (same Walker blood that my dogs carry) and a Mnt. Cur female, both papered dogs so I was able to see what they come from. This pair are really well built and have some smarts. I kept the male and let a close friend take the female. I started him and he seemed to have good prey drive and some natural instincts. I also have two dogs out of my family of dogs that are 1. I’m a believer in selective breeding and purpose bred animals. One of my pups had been hunted about 4-5 times now and yesterday was the second trip for the other one and the the mnt. Cur too. The difference in the dogs was very evident. I took them to a honey hole on purpose as I had some friends in from out of state. I cast hunt and when I cut the three of the young dogs loose with the two older dogs, they all left with them and were on hogs immediately. We caught 3 in real short order and then loaded the dogs and went across the road to another spot. Again I cast them all and they were bayed in just a minute. These hogs are really wild as they get lots of pressure in any and every way imaginable. As soon as they started baying the hogs broke. The old dogs and my two pups ran one down that tried to cross open country and they had him stretched, he wasn’t a 100 pounds. Immediately the old dogs rolled over and bayed again about 6-700 yards away. I never said a word to my pups. They heard them and had enough sense to realize their hog was dead and they went to the old dogs as hard as they could. I had to go back and get the other dog where they originally bayed. He was just kinda hanging out. When I got him where he could hear the bay extremely well, I cut him loose but he didn’t go to them until we were 50-75 yards from it. Then he was real loose baying and more booger barking than baying. My two pups were working the hog. He absolutely knew that if he made a mistake they were gonna make him pay. Eventually he flushed at the two pups and when they went to avoid him he turned and made a break for it. His mistake was that they didn’t turn and run from him and take their eyes off of him and the two old dogs were opposite them and they were able to grab him in the pride and joy to turn him. This stopped the hog in a spot where they could all get to him without being where they couldn’t move. They stretched him too, again only about 140 pounds. The old dogs left again but we toned them back in because they were headed in a direction I didn’t want them to go. I had led the young dogs away and when the old dogs checked in I sent them the way I want them to go. One of my pups went with them when they went through where he was hunting and they bayed again about 800 yards out. My other pup heard them and went from where he was. The Mnt. Cur never went until I was 50 yards away again. Myself and one buddy watched them bay and work for over ten minutes before my nephew and another buddy got to us with the catch dog. This was a better hog. Again they weren’t just barking but had meaning and purpose in what they were doing. I was pretty thick but they were as tight as they could be without putting themselves in harms way. The hog finally rushed one of my young dogs and he cut him pretty good. As soon as the hog did that though, the old male dog was in his back door biting him which got him off the pup. The hog spun to get at him and the old gyp and the other pup dove in and turned him again keeping him off the old male. The pup that got cut never quit. In fact he got mad and it just added some more passion to the song he was singing. The Mnt. Cur never got in on any of this because he was too far back. If all these dogs had been as far back as the Mnt. Cur, this hog would’ve never stood and took this bay. 100% he would’ve broke and ran. These hogs will not take a bay unless you make them. The point I’m getting at is not that I’m a great breeder but that the purpose bred dogs exposed the difference between themselves and the non purpose bred dog. The Mnt. Cur will make a dog but it’s going to take a lot longer and odds are he will never be the same caliber as the other two pups. There is also a difference in the smarts they have. My two are problem solvers on their own where the Mnt cur is able to be taught things. An example would be feeding time. My two have been turned out with the old dogs since they were about 8 weeks old. They run loose all day everyday together until feeding time then they each go in their own kennel to eat and then I come back and let them out when everyone is done. Since the second day those pups were out with the grown dogs they have gone straight to their own kennel, sit quiet, and never put their head in the food bowl
until I close the gate. The Mnt cur is still waiting at the feed house door when I come out with the feed bucket and is the last one to get in his kennel everyday. This is two months into having him and he’s grown vs the other two been doing right since 8 weeks old and on the second day. Brains accompanied by drive is just super hard to beat. Both parents of the Mnt. Cur are using dogs but the hog mindedness of my pups vs the the Mnt Cur that is just out of working parents of two different disciplines is undeniable.


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[perk]

We don't have any hogs so I wouldn't know what it takes to have good successful hunts, but you seem too. What traits makes you like the cur in your hog dogs? Just curious

[lawdawgharris]

Perk the only things I like about the cur is that they add speed, working style ( many refer to it as herding instincts ), and they quiet the mouth on track. Hogs have evolved since I put my own pack of dogs together 30 years ago. Everyone puts pressure on them in some form. Either shooting at them, trapping, dogging, etc. so the stand and fight hogs have been caught which leaves the flight before fight types to breed to one another. Most of these hogs will get up and leave if they hear a dog coming from far enough away. So I like quiet until they are looking at a hog. I want them to really be able to push a track hard and fast. If they start a hog they should finish it. When they find it they need to be able to keep it bayed and do whatever it takes to make that happen stopping just short of putting themselves in a bad position. Obviously if they are cut down or dead they can’t bay it. There is a difference in barking at a hog and baying. I love the bottom, the nose, but most of all the drive the hound brings to the table. Too much bite or too little bite is a super fine line and is usually relative to the terrain, and the style of hogs you’re hunting. Brains allows for this line to not seem like such a tight rope. Smart dogs know when and how much pressure to apply. I’m not suggesting this is what my dogs are but it’s definitely the goals and objectives I try to accomplish with every breeding.


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[macedonia mule man]

The most successful hog hunters I know of, had a mixture of dogs. They usually had a horse trailer with a dozen or so dogs of nondescript. No catch dogs, mostly 22mag. Or 243. Most dogs looked like house dogs, chow type, more hair than you normally see. Bottom line,they caught a lot of hogs and ate the meat.

[lawdawgharris]

Mule man I grew up hunting with some of those exact type. In the beginning I was one of them myself. If anyone said I have a dog I wanta get rid of, I would normally stop them right there with “I’ll take it”. Hunted or hunted with about every breed out there lol. To be honest I wouldn’t trade that for anything. It taught me a ton of lessons and molded me into what I am now. My buddy and I once hunted with a fella that is exactly what you described. We arrived to our hunting destination that morning early. He and I had one dog each. When he pulled up he was pulling a stock trailer. When he opened the gate, 23 MONGRELS and 2 mules came pouring out. It was a cluster from start to finish. The hogs caught weren’t fit to eat because there were so many dogs grabbing and pulling on them. Dogs are pack animals. I have proven this next point to many people over the years. Several buddies have cried about the fact that their dogs are always getting cut up but nothing they have is suicidal. I have explained that they are putting entirely too many dogs on the ground. I tell them to put their hunting pack to the bay pen and see for themselves. Dog one goes in and bays from 10-15 foot from the hog (200ish pounds). Dog 2 is sent and both are 10 foot away but way more intense. Dog 3 and they pull up to with 7-8 foot. Dog 4 brings them to 5 foot and they are darting in and out nipping at the hog and the hog is starting to get hot footed and looking for an escape route. Dog 5 and the hog breaks and runs with all the dogs grabbing trying to get ahold. Dog 6 and the hog has to stop and fight. All the dogs are trying to catch it but none are truly committed so the hog is sending them flying like boomerangs. Dog seven means caught hog and usually a bunch of cut up or dead dogs in a live hunt. If they would’ve split their dogs up into 2 packs they would’ve caught more hogs, fewer vet bills, and hogs they caught could’ve used to eat. I describe it just like gang bangers. The more of them there are the tougher they are. You can’t make something tough that isn’t tough at heart. No matter how much help they have, when the right pressure is returned they ALWAYS show their true colors. As for shooting hogs, I have shot plenty and seen plenty shot. In my opinion the 30/30 is as good a brush gun as there is made. There are a couple of issues pretty often with shooting. One is a hog is going to be in the thickest place it can find for defense. MANY MANY times I have been on my belly crawling in to them with no chance of shooting the hog without shooting a dog too or having the hog chewing on you before you know it’s there or before you can get your gun up. The catch dog route means the hog is being controlled when I crawl in there. I have seen catch dogs go in and catch a dog too. I have seen extremely good and experienced hunters go to shoot a hog and the second they squeeze the trigger the hog goes to flush at a dog or the dog anticipates the hog moving and jumps right in the line of fire. Now you have a dead dog or crippled dog that is of no more use. My luck is that it would be my best dog. The dog caught by the catch dog lives and fully recovers but the one bit by the bullet is lost for good. I have literally been looking straight down on hogs, less than 2 feet away, and not been able to tell you what size or sex they were or which way they were facing. These hogs now are so wild that the second they see, smell, or hear a human the race is on. So if you don’t get a clean shot before that happens it’s so long. I can use a catch dog in any of the scenarios successfully but not the gun. I know some hunters that have been at it a long time that only shot hogs up until the last 5 years. Now they use catch dogs because of the way hogs have evolved. To each their own and I wouldn’t tell anyone how to hunt. But for me and where I hunt, I have done and tried it about every way it can be done and this is what has been most productive for me. Another benefit to catch dogs is that when you kill a hog in the summer, you have to get them gutted, cleaned, and on ice or they will spoil quickly. If I catch and tie one, he’s alive until I get him home where I can process it without worrying about it ruining. Just like the world we live in, hog hunting isn’t what it was 30 years ago.


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[lawdawgharris]

One of those lessons learned about hunting any and every kind of dog was that when I got to hunt with purpose bred dogs, the consistency and the quality went way up. A purpose bred dog set the standard for me. He had every attribute that I thought and still think made him exceptional. When I saw that what I wanted in a dog was possible to have, I started trying to get that and quit messing with any and every dog that was offered. It wasn’t long and my 2 year old dogs we’re making some 4-5 year old dogs that were considered good, look pretty second rate on a real regular basis. Even when the older dogs were cast first, these young dogs would locate first, be at every hog (usually because they were there first), and be the last dogs we picked up because they were still rolling. Not only were the purpose bred dogs higher quality but they were easier to train and made dogs much faster. Realizing that, with the confirmation of the older mentors, it made it easier to try to accomplish raising my own purpose bred dogs. I have seen many pound puppies make dogs. I have also seen people try to breed them because they were real good only to be let down because the dog was an exception to the rule not the norm. Purpose bred dogs are just more purpose minded which makes them much more natural. It doesn’t matter if the discipline is ducks, hogs, cats, bears, etc. It doesn’t mean that my hog dogs won’t find and tree coons, but the odds are that there are a bunch of dogs that have been bred for generations to find and tree coons that will be much more natural and better at it.


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[macedonia mule man]

Lawdawg,l doubt the thought of improving their dog power or the thought of dog safety everinteredtheir mind. When they left out, it was for the meat. I guess it had to be a little intertwining to them but I couldn’t tell li if it was.

[lawdawgharris]

Lol that’s sure a possibility


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[Redwood Coonhounds]

I didn't get much of a bear season this fall due to a back injury. I was hurt a few months and then out of work so couldn't even afford the gas to go once I did feel better. So I've been coon hunting mostly since first part of November. Nothing too exciting but it gets the dogs out. Then I just got CoVID for New Years. Set me back a week. I do really enjoy it though, hunting coon in the west is much different and challenging than anywhere else. I hunt the thick swamp area, briars, vines, wild roses, tules, deep water. Catch a lot on the ground and in the water. Dogs learn how to get in that thick stuff. I have a puppy who is about 5 months old, from what I call my disaster litter this summer. She is small for her age. So I haven't really done much but haul her with me. She is starting to poke around and go, not sure what she does while she's out there. But that's how most mine start, they just kinda go until they find something that fires them up. I should have had another litter around Christmas, but the female didn't take. She is getting older. The second time in a row she was empty. Actually making 3 times in the last year I've had females come up empty. In over 17 years of breeding. I think its something to do with where I live now. Water, weather, something. I also have an 18 month old male who is really making a nice dog. I can start hunting my private property after duck season ends and hopefully get this puppy going. Might have something more to write home about. The rest of my dogs are all getting some age. I wish I could breed a few more of them, I just don't have kennel space sadly.

[lawdawgharris]

Redwood it could be a lot of things obviously as to why your females are missing, but try this. At the very least they will have good balance. Years ago a friend of mine was given 3 AAA grade race horse mares. All of them were excellent mares and bred very well but the owner couldn’t get colts out of them. Either they wouldn’t conceive or would sluff the colt before foaling. She brought them home and the only thing she did that the previous owner didn’t do was start them on probiotics everyday. When she took them and had them bred, all 3 took and carried their foals to term. I bought an American bulldog female once. She was bred when I got her but looked horrible. Not long after I got her she had pups. All of them were born dead and some of them were underdeveloped. She kept a gut and her hair was dry and course, dead looking. I had wormed her good when I got her so I didn’t feel like that was the issue. I started her on probiotics and in two weeks time she shed her hair and lost her pot gut. In a month she had hardened up and people that hadn’t seen her in that time didn’t even recognize her. She carried her next litter to term. We have had females that had irregular cycles and started them on probiotics and in a couple months they were in and bred. I have an intestinal disease and so I have done a good bit of reading and studying the gut. If the gut is off then everything is off, hormones to brain chemicals to immune system to the reproductive system, etc. I could give you examples all day long about the things probiotics do. My friend is one of the top greyhound people in the world. He sold more dogs for more money than anyone else at the nationals a year or two ago mainly because his kennel was the only healthy kennel there. His kennel was also the only one that fed probiotics daily. His kennels at different tracks have done the same thing for the same reason. Depression is often caused because of an out of balance gut. The gut and the brain produce the same chemicals. If one gets off it robs from the other. There is a company called Health Gard (correct spelling) that makes one of if not the best out there. It’s a liquid that you can put on their feed. They have Equine, K9, and human but charge different for each but they are all exactly the same so just buy the K9 and you can take it too. Nobody in my family has started barking or howling because of it. It is odorless and flavorless. You can put it in your tea or coffee or whatever. The only thing that kills it is sunlight. My kids will take it straight out of the cap because it doesn’t have a flavor.

[Redwood Coonhounds]

I do keep my dogs on probiotics, plus feed a decent food that has them already included as well. Plus I supplement Wheat Germ oil on bitches I plan to breed. These last misses the only thing different is I literally live in a different area with different climate and a well instead of city water. The well water here is super hard. Before I lived in the mountains where it was colder, and now I live where its over 100 degrees most the year. The fact is both the females who missed were sisters, and they are getting older. The one who missed twice had a litter before when she was 4 years old, and the other missed once with frozen semen and then had a litter with natural cover. I don't think genetics are to play though as their mother was the most fertile dog to live. She had a litter at 2, 4, 6 and 8 years old and raised every single pup, the fattest shits you ever seen. I think I just tried to breed old bitches using SUPER old males and didn't time it right.

[lawdawgharris]

Yeah that’s probably it. It’s sucks when you can’t get those old reliables to reproduce anymore. On the high note, you can start telling stories like me and everyone else about how great those old dogs were in their prime. The stories really grow when they die. I told a young man some stories over the Christmas holiday about how good my old Clyde dog was. First one he fell for. I told him that he was so good I had to put tape over one nostril or Clyde would run two hogs at one time. Second story he was all in until I told him Clyde went and got the truck while me and the catch dog were tying the last big hog. Lol


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[macedonia mule man]

A good breeding program will make you forget about the old generation,

[Redwood Coonhounds]

"A good breeding program will make you forget about the old generation"

I wouldn't say forget. I was lucky and had some really outstanding foundation dogs. But you are correct, as much as I miss them, the dogs I have now are just as good or better, and I expect each generation to be better. Otherwise I didn't do my job...

I just waited to long to breed these guys because my circumstances in life changed over the years and I can't keep and hunt as many dogs as before. So I just never bred them unless I could keep a few pups. I regret that now. At least had I bred them before when they were young there might be something out of them still out there for the future when I can have more dogs. Being the only person keeping and entire gene pool/breeding program going is hard work. Really hard. It's been a struggle the last 17 years and now seems impossible.