Hound guy turned cur

[Tanner Peyton]

Oh man, I've been searching the Internet over for cur breeders and just found out this morning there's a page on here dedicated to ummm. Genius loyd, pure genius. Haha, anyhow I have tuns of questions you guys as the title says I don't know jack about curs. I was a hound fella for about ten years and ran mostly coon. But with in the last three years I've gotten into bobcats and I am absolutely the most God aweful bobcat hound hunter to ever grace the sport with its presents. So I'm looking for a bobcat bread cur. First and for most the wife got a promotion and a transfer so I'm living in a apartment for at least another 12 months in central Nebraska. I completely sold out all my hounds and hound gear. But when we're done here were moving back west to the panhandle of Nebraska and I'm getting back into the sport. There is good numbers here and a year long season on bobcat. But the land is in small parcels here so I need a silent dog that I can put a lot of discipline on. Truspassing dogs get shot here all the time. Can't be mean or shy, never been able to do much good when them types of dogs. And also not to much gritt, I like a bay dog and thus im the one who decides what game we leave and what game we take home. So my first question is this: are these traits that anyone is breaking for? And second I've heard that cur are a really smart breed and very trainable is this true? And last, is this version of what I'm looking for realistic for curs? Or am I going to be looking for ever to find this dog. Oh year, and medium to cold nose!!! Thanks guys.

[Jeff Eberle]

[dwalton]

I have had Leopard curs for 9 years running them with my hounds. They are not hounds and handle tracks different. I was not expecting them to be as cold nose as they are. I have had then catch bobcats that all the hounds came back on that they could not trail mostly in adverse conditions, dry, or hard rain and in very cold dry snow. That said they will not pound a track like some hounds do, if they can't move it they will not work it. Mine are open mouth but don't say much on a track until jumped. Very smart easy to handle but soft won't put up with abuse. Great tree dogs. They are thinking dogs.Most are more trainable then a lot of the humans that I have met. I will always have one in with my hounds. Just my opinion. Dewey

[dwalton]

Something that I believe is that it be a hound or a cur it can be taught to cold trail better or not to cold trail by the way they are hunted. Bobcat hunting is cold trailing for me and I always work with a dog to improve how he or she cold trails and what they do with a cold trail. You will not see a dog here that stops throws up his head and bawl when he smells a track. They may put their head down to smell a track but when they open heads are up and they are moving preferably opening only when they are in the lead with a clean track. For me that is the key to a bobcat hound, their ability to move a cold track fast. If you have that the rest comes easy. I feel most hounds do not have that ability. Just some toughest Dewey

[dwalton]

Something that I believe is that it be a hound or a cur it can be taught to cold trail better or not to cold trail by the way they are hunted. Bobcat hunting is cold trailing for me and I always work with a dog to improve how he or she cold trails and what they do with a cold trail. You will not see a dog here that stops throws up his head and bawl when he smells a track. They may put their head down to smell a track but when they open heads are up and they are moving preferably opening only when they are in the lead with a clean track. For me that is the key to a bobcat hound, their ability to move a cold track fast. If you have that the rest comes easy. I feel most hounds do not have that ability. Just some thoughts Dewey

[Jeff Eberle]

Dewey, I totally agree with you on the Leopards it is very strong traits that you described ,As mine are only crossed with Leopards and are the same way. But to think there is no hound mixed in way back on them I have to disagree with you on that part. I know there is no hiding it in the Wick Camo line but don't kidd yourself thinking its not in the ones called cur as well .

[Jeff Eberle]

And as for the nose of a Leopard the only way I have ever described it is a nose of opportunity more then hot , med or cold.

[Tanner Peyton]

Thanks fellas, I guess the reason I say cold nose is because of those dry months. Late August till early October. I really struggle that time of year. It sure doesn't take long for a track to dry up in those months. I do agree that a dog can learn to cold trail as I have seen. But what I was thinking is that I would like a silent dog on trail at least till the track is smoking hot or it's been jumped. I don't plan on hunting um to hard. Maybe 120 days a year, once or twice a week all year long. Most of the time they'll just be laying in the yard. So they won't be abused to much. I don't really shock or beat dogs either. If feel that's a great way to have one scared of you. I was looking at the leapards pretty hard but having a hard time find the semi silent ones. Maybe I need to start thinking about making some of my own crosses here one of these days. Just wondering Is that John wick you guys speak of? Anyhow thanks fellas.

[david]

John wick wrote "the tree dog encyclopedia" which you should read while you are laid up in an apartment.

He promoted a dog called wicks camo jug who was bred by John Clark. Most of us would not know a thing about Clark's dogs if not for Wick.

Since his promotion UKC adopted leopard curs as a breed of UKC coon hound. Thus: leopard hound.

If you want to try some pure jug stuff there is a litter on the ground right now in south western nebraska that is as pure jug as you will find.

However it is not what you are looking for.

Try going to squirrel dog central and ask about Carl smith and the streak dogs. Tell them you need a dead silent dog. They will have other ideas for you as well.

ALSO check squirrell haters.com. Make no mistake, of the dogs that have "accidentally" treed bobcats, I don't know of any more named than silent squirrel dogs.

Jack and Sharon Jones in Missouri is another name you can ask about. They talk of catching bobcats with their Cajun squirrel dogs and their line of jagdterriers.

I honestly don't know how you will catch bobcats in a small space unless the dog surprises them and they jump up the first tree. To hold a FRESH cat bayed in one spot is easier said than done.

We sure wish you the best though and hope you keep us posted.

[david]

Also there are dogs among the "Treeing cur" designation that will catch bobcats.they are part hound part cur and can be UKC registered. The "amazing cur" promoted by Amy Kovac have traits I would look for if I was in your situation. IF you could find one that won't bark until treed or caught. Many of them open on hot track though so be very specific.

[dwalton]

Jeff there is a lot of hound mixed into cur dogs especially with the introduction of Cammo. My curs come Waynne Hensley in Virginia. Most go back to McDuffys and Rex Bowers dogs with Tig showing up 6 times in a three generations. They are short eared chop mouth dogs. Who knows what they have in them but they sure don't look like any hound I have seen. Most of my hounds have a little cur blood back a ways but still look like hounds. Just maybe it is up to the breeder and what he wants to do or the honesty of the breeder. Dewey

[Tanner Peyton]

Good deal David I feel like I'm kinda on the right track. I put Carl's number in my little black book of dogs. And thanks for all the other info. I did read johns book walk with wick so I'll get that other one and read it as well. Thanks for that tip also. Some of dry dirt hounds from the four corners I was using were fairly quite on track and real accurate. Kinda like the one I gave Ed (rush X Pyscho). Might not be hard to bread the voice out of them. Also I had a trigg / treeing walker I got out of Wisconsin that I wanted to try. This guy said the clays use his dogs from time to time and really liked umm. But I had to move and never got a chance to train her up, thus she had to go. Another name I found was Mike Kemmer and Charles Fason. That Charles says he does some crossing with some guys out in Wyoming for some decent Bob dogs. Thanks for the info I got a lot of work to do. Maybe some day I'll get this all figured out.

Tanner

[david]

Tanner you get around. Where did the Isen dog from Wisconsin end up? I have one in my yard. You let go of some versitile and impressive breeding there. Definately not silent though. The trigg part was from Cecil Boggs in Virginia. I spent some time with Cecil and enjoyed it so much. He is a wonderful person.

The cur universe is fascinating and vast. You could study it the rest of your life and never find all the family traditional lines. What you are looking for is out there. And so is a million dollars of undiscovered gold. Start mining for your dog. I think percentages of culls in the cur world is higher. But if you get a real good one you will be ruined.

I kind of feel bad encouraging you to try this wood-lot bobcat hunting. I have never known of anyone who tried it, let alone succeeded.

You would really need him streight on cats to catch cats and you need to catch cats to get him streight. Given your space limitations, it seems nearly impossible.

I would probably hunt him on squirrels and get him broke that way. Let him know bobcats are good, and after he experiences the thrill of cats he will prefer the cat if there is one in the wood lot. Break him off coon, and check those woods at night as well. If you are like me you will be shocked when he trees a squirrel on the outside at night.

Have fun.

[Tanner Peyton]

Well I picked up that Ison dog about four months before Meagan got her promotion. I was going to try and keep her at my moms for awhile till I found a place but that wasn't fair to my mom or the dog so I gave her to Ethan. That dog was a pure pleasur to look at, listen to, and watch run a hot track. She's about 10 months now and my hope is to keep he with in a couple of hours of me then some day maybe I'll get some pups from her. Sounds like she's givin Ethan a hard time so she might go to Kansas, not kidding Kansas has the most short tails I've ever seen. But yeah I've tried about every dog a guy can think of out here. My pal has a map with pins in it from all the places I've tried. Think I'm up to 13 different states haha. Got an excellent cold nose dog from Kevin burgesses wish I still had him. John cash and cheese burger Eddy were two greats. Ones catching bears and the othe is chasing lions in the rocks. Except for the speed dogs crossed with treeing hound those were my next move, trigg cross, fox cross, running cross. But here lately I'm kind intreauged with these silent tracking dogs. I wanna find a real solid cold nosed meat hound and cross with that Ison dog just to see what happens. I think that's where my gold might be. But I've never heard of silence being a passed on trait. But then Again a lot of guys consider that kind of dog a cull so maybe they don't get bread that often in order to find out.

[bearsnva]

David and dwalton,
Never figured I would be posting to two "cat hunters" about several mutual acquaintances. Wayne Hensley raises some good dogs that will make a bear climb and Mr. Cecil Boggs is a legendary hound man from way back. Both are members of the Virginia Bear Hunters Association and are very enjoyable to talk hunting with and are good men.