BigGameHoundsmen.com

what kills me is one of our trophy units in south central utah. I have 8 bonus points and still have not drawn a tag, so I figure it must be a pretty hard unit to draw. Yet despite the fact that it is a trophy unit they upped the tags this year, almost every cat killed up there was a female. it's like people get their panties in a bunch when they finallyget a cat in a tree like it might be the only one they tree this year. I don't really blame outfitters cuz when you have a client all you can really do is advise them that if they hold out they will probly go home with a tom. but who are these guys shootin 80 lb females for themselves???? that unit feeds and helps support the overkill of all the adjacent units, but I guess not anymore after this year. b-plott pm me when you figure out what we need to do and I will support you 100 %. if I figure out a solution you will be the first to know. gas prices are getting way too high to have to drive 10 days to run one cat. let's just hope we have a dry spring, it will make for a great next year.

What an absolute joke!!!!!!

I HAVE THE BEST SOLUTION!!!!

Sell all the lion, bear and bobcat tags over the counter statewide.

Then FIRE ALL UDWR EMPLOYEES that are involved in any way with these animals!!!!!!!!
Hell jim k. just took over YOUR job. How's that for budget cuts STUPID?????

Its very clear the udwr wants to destroy what's left of the lion population!!!!!
GAME ON KILL EM ALL!!!!!!!

15 years of aggresive lion harvest and the mule deer population still SUCKS!!!!
Keep beatin that dead horse!!!! ZERO RESULTS

I'm with the DAWG its just a clown show watchin jim and the dwr puff the sfw rooster if ya know what i mean!!!

UDWR code for highest bidder.
SELL OUTS JUST LIKE THE DIRECTION OF WASHINGTON D.C.

http://wildlife.utah.gov/dwr/news/42-ut ... -utah.html

SHAMEFUL!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

houndnem wrote:what kills me is one of our trophy units in south central utah. I have 8 bonus points and still have not drawn a tag,

Houndem, how many lions do you have to kill in your lifetime. I took a lion fifteen years ago and have not bought a kill tag or even applied for a draw tag since. I personally believe that lions should be a "once in a life time". You could buy a kill tag every year until you kill a lion and take it to the game warden to be tagged. Then you would be done and could not buy another kill tag. You could still buy a pursuit permit. I think alot less females would be taken if you were limited to only one lion in a lifetime. This would work for the bears as well.
LeRoy

Killroy, I have killed 2 lions in the 11 years that I've been doing this. one was a tom the first year I had my own dogs and one was a female that I killed to save my dogs lives. I really don't care about killin another lion but if I was to draw that tag I would hunt my a$$ off and if I found a book cat I would kill it. I do belive in one of your past post you said you have taken over 100 lions with hunters. now I know that you were makin your living and I don't blame you. I guide a couple a year too. but who's to blame when there are no lions????? we are. I don't think that when I kill my trophy tom will impact the lion population in a negative way. it has been said that those old toms kill alot of kittens anyway. the problem is that nobody is selective about it anymore. they would rather kill a kitten or an 80 lb female than go home empty handed. The way I look at it is you can buy a tag next year too so go home empty this year in hopes of treein a booner next year.
when I first got dogs I had one thing on my mind, killin cats! I thought that was the answer to getting our deer herds back up. after a few years having dogs I realized that one treed and relised cat was funner than a whole stack of deer horns in my garage collecting dust. I think most people that have been doing this a while feel the same. but it's the people that have hounds that think like I used to that are hurting us.
I love how you always try to demonize me for killing that female when you claim 100 kills. how many of those hundred were females??? I disagree that once in a lifetime cat huntin is the answer. most people only kill one or two in a lifetime anyways. I do think that we all need to come together as houndsmen and figure out a solution, but I don't know how we'll ever do it when none of us can stand each other. Your a great guy killroy, but don't point the finger of blame my way unless you are willing to take some of it your way as well.

Maybe you boys ought to PM each other with your pissing match.

Hell the problem here in Utah and everywhere else in this country is that there is not 10 people that can stand together on any one thing. Look where it's taking us.

I agree with Bplott on not killing the cats on these units but the fact of the matter is that on two of the units, my guess is, the quota will be filled. Hunting conditions on those two units are pretty darn good right now and are forcast to get better this weekend. Unfortunatly with this quota in my neck of the woods, I am with Yard Dog, the conditions are pretty good for late Febuary/March and I wouldn't be surprised if these units around here get more cats killed than the quota allows. Yeah......it sucks.
Let the races begin on Monday. It flat sucks...

Tom's boys Tom's!!!!!!!!!!!! You tree a female and think you better do it now or never; think again. There's tomorrow and always next year!!!!! Also the mentality that if you don't shoot it, the next guy will IS A CROCK! Grow a set and get out to find a TOM if your dead set on killing!

Houndem, I want to apologize. Didn't mean to single you out.

We all have things that bother us, I know of two other houndsman who took lions this year who had already taken two or three lions before. I personally don't know why anyone would want to take more than one lion, but that is my thinking. I turned my 15yr old nephew down the other day on a big tom, because I got him a tom two years ago. I let my hunters know that I don't think they should take more than one lion. I enjoy taking people out who have never taken a lion, most have never even seen a lion. I would rather be know as the houndsman who caught the big tom than the houndsman that killed the big lion.

My brother has had hounds for 30 yrs and guided many hunts and has never killed a lion himself. This thread is about bashing the DWR, I am not a fan of the DWR, I have been fighting them for the past 15 yrs. Maybe us houndsmen need to start with ourselves.
LeRoy

From what I have seen in the areas we hunt, it would not matter if the quotas were set at 12 or 1200. You cant kill what is not there. We have cut a lot of country and put quite a few miles on the sleds and not found much. Its funny when you talk to guys who have drawn tags for these areas and they are dumbfounded on why they cant find a track. These guys (most of whom do not have dogs) are the same ones who 6 months earlier would be going around telling of how we have lions everywhere. Give them a tag and a month or two of good fresh snows and watch how there perspective changes as they burn tank after tank of fuel with nothing to show for it. Somewhat of a poetic justice.
From what I have read and heard the southern part of the state is not in as bad of shape as what we have it out here (N.E). But if the DWR continues to put out permits and the hound guys are stupid enough to keep killing. Then you boys will know what "sucks" really is like.

Bplott have you or anyone been on the phone with the DWR and talked to them about this? It would be interesting to see how they made there decisiion to open these units? Did they go out and find a bunch of kills or what? How and why did they decide to do this? If they opened these units simply because the deer count was down we have troubles. Here is the only thing I can find

http://wildlife.utah.gov/dwr/news/42-ut ... -utah.html

if the dwr is bound and determined to help with the declining numbers of the bighorn sheep population they should just relocate more into utah. utah is goin to turn into yellowstone... the wolves was killin all the elk and deer, so they killed all the wolves, then the elk and deer populations went out of control so what did they do? they brought in wolves to thin out the populations and ended up with a hell of a time tryin to keep everythin balanced. the same thing is goin to happen here with the lions and deer. the dwr just needs to leave well enough alone and quit raisin the number of tags for lions, instead they should reduce the number of deer tags that they sell every year and quit dickin around with all the hunts. it worked in the past so why the hell wont it work now? thats just my 2 cents.

I have left to msgs for the state diector to call me back.... I talked to both keven bunnel and justin dollings..... basically I am hearing deer and sheep numbers but it is mainly fawn numbers that are down which does not trigger a lion poblem.... so I basically view it as a cover up to make deer hunters and other sportsmen beleave we still have lion problems...... I would urge anyone that sees the truck pulling a trailer around loading up road kills to get me some pictures and the location of the pic..... they are obviously over looking the 200000 deer killed on highways.... I'm trying to get some answers

I would be curious to see if there is any scientific data they used to come to this decision or if they just decided one day after counting the deer , oh the deer numbers are down fawns in particular must be those damn lions. Perhaps there is no bucks left to breed the does. None the less this is a chicken shit maneuver on the part of the DWR.

I realy hope houndem is right about the small number of guys that actually are catching later like this but i would be willing to bet there more than you would think just not the guys you run into driving all over. A fine example is an add of some fellas from salina that will help you fill your tag for $1000 giving three ph#and three names if these guys are better lion hunters than houndem thinks you fellas in central utah might get taste of us northern utahs type hunting

Our local news paper had an arcticle where DWR Wildlife program Manager Teresa Bonzo said that recent studies show the deer population decline was due to Highway mortality, and habitat changes.
Bonzo stated wildlife biologists and researchers estimate vehicles may kill as many deer a year as hunters do. However, the reports show hunters kill mostly bucks, while vehicles kill mostly does and fawns.

Bonzo said the DWR is having open house's all across the state this week to discuss deer population decline issues with the public. The one for southern Utah is on thursday March 10th from 5 to 7 P.M. at the DWR office in Cedar City 1470 N. Airport Road.
To find out about other open houses in the state Bonzo said to call 865-6100.

There was roughly 20000 bucks harvested by hunters last year......I'm sure highway mortality is much higher then that.....I personaly see 1-5 deer hit every day in the heber area on the highway....I have also seen what looked to be 30-40 deer on the highway department meat wagon being hauled to the garbage pile.......wish I woulda been able to get a pic of that trailer.....I have personaly reported deer that were obviously sick to the dwr... they wouldn't even investigate..... I know I can't spell real well but I'm guna give it a shot....MISS MANAGEMENT!!!