BigGameHoundsmen.com

We've got plenty of information on rigging lions, but how many consistantly catch lions in the dirt? I will admit I catch a few, but it seems that when the temperatures vary as much from night to day as they do in spring, summer, and fall it really depends on which end of the track you are on. I've caught a lion when it was 90+ outside in the afternoon, BUT the lion wasn't but a mile away. I know you southern boys don't know any other way, but I'm curious as to whether you think its harder now than say Jan, Feb, where you're hunting?

Sure it's harder right now. If the dogs don't get something done early, the rising temperature should shut things down. I've had to pull the dogs off of a track that was getting hotter because the temperature was also getting hotter. As the morning progresses on the desert, the rising temps make it dangerous to continue. I have never thought that a lion in a tree was worth the risk of even one of my dogs getting heat stroke. For me, this time of year it's best to be done for the day by about ten in the morning. If the dogs get on the short end of a track late in the morning, then end up in a fight with the lion, or in a high speed jumped race, heat stroke can, at the very least, ruin a dog. Leave early and come home early, or go fishing for the summer. I don't envy the guys and dogs that have to produce year around. Doing it on occasion for kicks is a lot different than doing it to keep a job. I know one guy that hunts at night all summer long. For me, that would stink!

Hell yes it's harder those dogs burn up when it gets too hot. But what you said still has a lot to do with catching on the dirt. Hitting the track right and being on the right end of it. also not all soil and terrain in the southwest is equal for dirt trailing some of the more northern zones that have a lot of sand, clay and alkili are not good and you better hope you are on the short end of the track. Some other areas mostly further south offer more rock, brush and ground cover to hold scent and the have more stable temperatures even if they do get hot that the higher elevations. The Sonoran lower deserts seem to hold scent better than say even 50 miles north of them with higher elevations and greater temperature swings day to night. I use to get hung up thinking that very little moisture had a lot to do with it. Over the years I have found moisture to be more of a hinderance than a help in bare ground work. It's nice to have some sub-surface if you can to keep it a little cooler, but I want that ground nice, stable and dry. Lion dogs can carry a track better on rock than they can on bare dirt, and that is why you see those old vetran dogs nosing them rocks or licking on them to wake up some scent.

I was talking to a proferssional west coast lion hunter the other day I asked the question how many days do you hunt before you normally strike a runable lion track? and then I asked him how many of those runable tracks do you catch a lion off of.

His answer was usually in 3 days I will hit a runable track in the area I hunt. Out of those tracks I probably tree one for every five I start.


I told him where I am at I figure one runable for every 7 days of hunting. Lion are quite scarce and scattered here, but i said i generally tree one out of three of those strikes.

Now does this mean I have worse lion country but better dogs?

No not at all it means that the tracks that my dogs can strike and run are considerably fresher than most of the tracks he hits. His country is better for holding a track longer than this are where the ground is predominantly sand and clay with very litte brush or grass. I am sure his dogs here would not strike any more than mine becasue we hunt predominantly the same type, but I am sure his catch percentage here would be as good or better than mine. so the country and density of lions has a lot to do with your success.

the thing with bare ground lion hunting is the bulk of the time the dogs have to find the track or the trail I should say becasue I am sure dogs go over many more lion tracks that they never open on that are too old. The human eye if we could see all these tracks much like we can after a snow fall could at times tell if it is fresh or if it may be a week or so old, but the dogs have to take them as they find them.

It is a challenge anywhere and anytime you go after a lion with your hounds. so about all I can say is pull your hat down put a smile on your face becasue you are out in God's creation and have fun with the dogs!

I knew it was harder....just wanted you fellers to chime in. In this area we have so many different types of hunting. We can be hunting shale rock, pinion juniper country or drive a little farther and hunt thick pines and deep canyons, sagebrush and quakies....you name it, but with that being said when hunting the shale rock by mid morning things are really getting tough. The pines and quakies a guy can trail considerably longer in....its funny just how much of a difference shade can make when them temps start rising....it sometimes is the differnce in catching or going home

Mike sir, whats your theory on why excessive moisture causes problems. I have noticed that to with our hot summers. We will get a summer rain and you think hot dog going to be good running tonite then dogs look like idiots. After thinking about it I came up with the theory that the dry soil soaks up the water like a sponge pulling the scent deeper into the dirt. Similar to how snow will trap the scent when it freezes and then releases it when it melts.

I gotta agree with that theory, mike and bear hunter.
some of these guys throw the term dry ground around way to loose. some of these northern boys have some of the best dogs in the game, but dry groundin to them is uaually when the snow is off the south slopes a little bit. however their feb march conditions when it is freezing ass cold are worse than dry ground. I do alot of 100 % dry ground hunting and catch a few, but some of these guys throw it around like you just run out and do it whenever you want and it's no big deal. I gotta laugh at that cuz it's a lot of work no matter how good your dogs are.

Well that moisture deal is funny. But them warm summer rains hitting that fry hot ground immeduatly whether you see it or not a steam vapor rises in the air and the scent particles go in evaporative manner with them. Anytime you see that vapor coming up off the ground you might as well go to the coffee shop cus the trailing is over. Moisture dilutes as well and you may trail like hell for a while even in a rain storm but let it break and the sun come out shining down and poof it's gone.

I remember me an old time hunter were setting on our horses years ago up above San Ysidro, New Mexico and the dogs had jumped a bear and they came across the side of the hill and they were right on his butt. The rain moved in on us and it was pretty warm weather. It was one of them freak little mountain showers that you can be on one side of a tree and get wet and it cuts off and is dry on the other side. Well it rolled passed and the clouds opened up and the sun came out, and the barking quit. Directly we saw Mr. Bear just hot footing it out across that park and up the other hill. Well that old steamy vapor was coming off that hot ground and those dogs came down thru there and they were just hopping around going woof! woof! woof! but they couldn't line that bear out and in about ten minutes they couldn't even woof no more that trail was adios.

Now imagine if that had been a lion or much less a bobcat? Probably wouldn't even go the first woof out of them. LOL!A wet bear is suppose to leave a lot of scent but that one didn't.

Houndenem. We are pretty limited when it comes to our seasons for runnin cats. And for the most part I believe our dogs spend more time on the ground then most. And conditions in relation to A track is A pretty big issue. We have been in six inches of snow and it get up to melting temps and have the dogs stall out. Is just A hunting deal. And been in cold temps when the snow is A dry snow and made the mistake of dropping the gate when I shoulda let A starter get it going. But as in all things you never learn anything unless you try it yourself..

Rhino.

the number of tracks you start has a good deal to do with how familiar you are with the country. There are spots a guy could go and really look good aslong as he didn't kill the cat. when you find one of those real predictable homebodies it's in your best interest not to pull the trigger. a real live pup trainer is as good as it gets somedays. if a guy covers enough ground often enough he will up his odds again just by getting to know where the cats typically hang out if they are in the area. if a guy had to just start cold in a area he'd be hard put to get much done.
I had a dog dealer tell me he doubted anyone was catching more then four or five lions a year anywhere in the desert. guess that gives a little hindsight in his current proffesion. but he sure uses the azlion dog angle to pockett some change. that speaks volumes about the quality