BigGameHoundsmen.com

Friends,
I hunt a deer lease in Mexico near Laredo, Eagle Pass. We currently don't run cows but may in the future. I am thinking to bring a couple of dogs down to put some pressure on the cats (bobs and puma). I have been introduced to Catahoulas and can appreciate the dogs versatility and the fact that it will probably range less.

All the Great Local cat men hunt Walkers.

How do Catahoula Leopard Dogs perform compared with Walkers ?

Thanks...

Catahoulas are excellent hog and wild cow dogs and run to catch and go to the front. My experience is a bit limited with them except on wild cattle and a little bit of them running to catch up with my hounds on bear and lion in southeast Arizona. The ones I have seen have allways run silent to semi silet unless jumped I have never seen one take what we would clissify a cold track on a game animal or even a colder wild cow track(so we always ran a few hounds even on cattle).

I think there is a good reason the men in the area you desrible run walkers. They have colder noses, they can move a bad track and they can take the heat pretty good. Most of the walkers in that area are grade type and usually have a little beagle and or running blood in them and they produce results.

There is an old saying about trying to re-invent the wheel or trying to make a silk purse out of a sow's ear. If it ain't broke don't fix it, you can get your walkers to handle and stay close if you work them right.

Cathoulas have their place but it's not catching bobcats and panthers in dry arid country..... You may get struck by lightning occasionaly and find one that will work but your odds would probably be better in Los Vegas.

I agree with mike the catahualas aren't a desert dog. They are busy workers but don't have the patience for a cold track. Or a bad one. Most bobcat tracks are aging fast the minute they're laid down. If you hunted a higher elevation only you might catch some but not enough for the dog to ever shine. They do put a stylish finish on a jumped lion and are a pretty good locator in the rocks. Another drawback to the cattle strain here is the aggressive streak. One of the more houndy strains that is proven to trail bad tracks might be the only exception. But if the pic you posted is the majority of your terrain your going to need some help in the dog dept. If you can hunt nights you'll do much better and if you can rig your dogs from area to area at least. That ground can wear out a dog fast in warm weather if you try to walk them everywhere. If you have guys that are catching game go watch their dogs and see what they are doing and how they make it happen then try the same if you see that the only way they are catching is by spending a huge amount of time covering ground and then its pop ups you might try something different. I only bring this up because I spent two weeks in mexico a few years ago convinced I had heard of a better deal. It turned out to be one guy who covered more ground in a day then any hunter I've been with and IF he or his dogs saw a cat they helled after it until it was caught or lost not a bad way to kill time checking cows and water but not very effective in my mind. My recommendation would be west texas cat hunters or someone that runs in a similar area. Good luck I hope you get started right.

I think what Mike said is correct
Here in Mexico we use running beagle dog crus
I can not speak of catahula that I have no experience with them but I've seen in the hogs and believes they are not very nose.
if you want to see Mexicans working dogs I work laredo these areas give me a call and you look with your eyes working my dogs.
I caught one lion 3 days ago in Laredo to 11 months no rain in very dry and hot dogs and spend 3 hours trail dust cactus spines lion moved to where the rest and it was a race of 20 minutes to climb the tree.
Here you need dog that has good nose but not a word.
and put pressure when due.

only what I learned in my country

THANKS
TOMORROW GIVE PHOTOS

Hi Memo. You use silent hounds specifically for Puma or more so for bobcat? Do you run a small 2 to 4 hound pack? I am interested in your pictures and any other information you want to share. Thank you for posting.

pegleg wrote:Hi Memo. You use silent hounds specifically for Puma or more so for bobcat? Do you run a small 2 to 4 hound pack? I am interested in your pictures and any other information you want to share. Thank you for posting.

pegleg sorry not explain
my dogs are not silent., mabe semi silent, but having intelligence
to move forward not hitting a lot of nose to the ground
caugth days ago one lion trail 3 hours, but little bark much moving tail, Avans much
moving tail and throw in 50 yards barking sometimes take minutes to bark next
Dogs can not have put a lot of nose on the ground that the sun is coming to win and need to get where is the lion to press.
I DO NOT WANT TO SAY THAT THESE DOGS ARE BETTER but here are what work best
says Mr. Clay and Mike L there are styles of dogs funsion better in other countries and not because here it works everywhere else I go to work I am sure that
I have seen very good dogs do in arizona
and not being able to laredo same can happen with these dogs can not arizona.
the ranch here are many ways to prepare them for deer hunting are very large and we have to put the dogs on the road and Avans many miles, when you know that a lion is killing deer in an area work horse in that territory.
caugth bobcats and so keep the dogs in action all year

thanks

The experience I have with hounds. The most productive type of hounds you can run in the Nuevo Laredo type of country, are the walkers with running walkers they use in south texas for bobs. (short ears, light weight, medium nose, tolerate the heat and very fast) the running type hound.

Thats the type of hounds Memo Jaramillo and Chapita are using , who are the two hunters for cat that I know that have more sucess here in Mexico.

As Mike Leonard says go for the type of hounds they are using in the area with sucess.

if you need to watch these dogs I have some pictures of bobcat hound them in the field, running dogs and Triggs

regards to all

Thanks for the lesson Mike, Pegleg, Memo and Hectorp
What a decision...
The Walker has a better nose but ranges.
The last thing I need to do in Mexico these days is to cross fence lines behind dogs.

Is their a way to keep them close?
Is their a hound line that will range less?
Should stay low profile on that side.

I come from the country that literally invented the Catahoula and since I've had them all my life, and still do, I think they're a fine dog. I've had some Catahoulas that would tree you a squirrel, bay a hog, catch a swamp cow, then tree you a coon or pesky neighbor all in the same day. But I agree with Mike about their potential as desert dogs and their mouth on a track. I come from a part of the country where coon hunters are a dime a dozen, but very few people here use Catahoulas for coon because of the reasons Mike pointed out. They work cattle and hogs by scent, but they are not what I'd consider a cold nose hound by any stretch of the imagination.

But what I call a bonafide Louisiana Catahoula Cur is NOT necessarily what UKC is registering as a American Leopard Hound. I don't know much about them, except that the one guy I know who has any sold all of his Blueticks and switched to the Leopards. He says they hunt closer, open plenty on track, and have more of the old time hound characteristics he was missing in his Blues.

I've owned and raised Catahoulas all of my life and still keep one around today. I think they're the finest all around dog in the country and no finer cow dog ever existed for the kind of cattle we have, but I don't care for them as a hunting hound much at all. For that, I prefer Blueticks because the strains I've always tried to keep tend to hunt close to medium with good cold noses.

Let me preface this by saying I have zip experience. However, I do read a lot of hound books and hound history.
The Leopard curs/American leopard hounds contain some blood of a Spanish colonial dog known as the Cuban Bloodhound. They were used throughout central America to hunt both big game and fugitives. I've seen pictures, and they look like a large, blue merle coonhound. I also know a dog that was brought to NY City that was picked up as a stray in Guatemala, that looks just like the pictures of these dogs in old books, so I am guessing there is still some of that blood around in Central America. You might look into something along those lines if its still around.
I wouldn't expect you're going to be able to run cattle and hunt cats with the same dog, unless you get very lucky with the individual. Herd dogs need a lot more cues from their handler than hounds look for. We had a blue heeler on our farm when I was growing up that could cut any cow you pointed at out of the herd and bring it to you at the fenceline. He could hold the herd together without being given direction, but I never saw him use his nose.

Larry,
Thanks for the input.
I am coming to understand the Catahoula is a great all around dog. We may have a place for one. The American Leopard is also an interesting breed. I understand they have more hound and hunt closer. I am considering getting on Mr. Oller's list for a puppy.

Here's a question you state your looking for a close working hound? How close I guess I'm confused here. Are you looking for a dog that WON'T take a track and get ahead of you or just strike near you? Any dog can be trained to work near you. All of mine will stay in my range until they hit a runnable track. So you might be focused a bit different then I understand. If you work a dog May trail at a set speed. I can't say I've ever tried it myself. Historically they just bred for physically slower dogs Ie bassets.

The more I learn about the American Leopard Cur and not the Catahoula Leopard the more I think it would work. I understand a hotter nosed dog will take a fresher track to possible have a shorter catch or tree. It seems true the colder the nose the potentially farther the chase.

The key to Mexico now is safety.
If you are still crazy enough to go, you should be smart about what you do...

I have ran Leopard curs with my cat dogs for five years know. I have some old walker breeding and run 1\4 t0 5\8 running dog walker cross now. I live in the Northwest but hunt in the eastern part of Oregon and the California desert. I have hunted in hot dry conditions but not as bad as you guys have it in Mexico. The curs will not pound a track like the hounds will on a old track. On a fresh track that is in the heat or dry cold the curs will out trail the hounds at times. They seem to to know the cat is close and will get it out of there when the hounds can't. They do not have the speed of the running dogs on track but will pack up to stay in there. It is hard on them physically to run up. I have crossed my Leopard with my fasted running dog on track. I will see if this works. If you could get the best of both worlds you would have a great cat dog. With breeding you could get everything or nothing. The curs seem to be thinkers and the hounds doers. Time will tell. Dewey