How long do your dogs live?

[Chris Todd]

Bludawg, and I wouldn't doubt you one bit. I think it does go to show how much conditions vary. I know that to be true when it comes to scenting conditions. And I don't see why it wouldn't vary concerning the longevity of hound. Maybe I have been lucky with my hounds living long and productive lives. One thing I don't do though is see a hound make it to a certain age then say their career is over. I let their health dictate that.

[mark]

I have caught a lion or two in my life in country that ranged from the desert of Nevada to the beach of the pacific ocean. Like wise with bobcats . I have never seen one of my dogs in top hunting shape on lions get all wobbly in the legs and have a hard time staying on its feet. I have seen it more than i like when they are running bobcats. Im not a vet by any means but i am sure in my own mind that this takes some longevity out of a dogs life.

[Chris Todd]

Mark I have seen what you are talking about on lion tracks more than once. I have packed a few dogs out that just plain gave out. Now in our case here it might be and probably is dehydration. Many of the areas I hunt have very little water.

[Chris Todd]

I wanted to tell one quick story about competitive drive and how it almost cost one hound his life.
. I was under the gun to catch a client a lion. The weather sucked where we were hunting wouldn't quit raining. So we moved camp west of Phoenix where I thought it would be drier and we could hunt. Well we got there and found out we had one day to hunt before the rain really started.
So we took off the next morning,and struck a lion almost right off at about 630. This lion was traveling. We started out on the flat desert. And by about 1000 were on top of a real high desert mountain range. The lion traveled the top for about a mile then turned and started back down the same side we had trailed up. So the hounds trailed 3/4ths of the way back down and jumped this lion. Well the lion put up a good run and bayed in some bluffs. Me and the hunter couldn't get to the lion before it jumped.
. The hounds came by us and I could tell they were in bad shape. It was now 100 and the hounds had been going 61/2 hours hard with no water. So when they went by I told the client and his friend we had to get that lion stopped and killed. So I fell in right behind them on my horse going as hard as I could. Our horses were about done and I knew that too. The hounds bayed the lion again. The hunter got there and killed his lion. When I got to the hounds only a couple were standing. One little hound I thought was dead. But he was just laying down on his side resting.
. When we got ready to leave he wouldn't get up. So I told these guys lets get the rest of these dogs to camp and water. I will come back and get him and bring some water for him. Well we got back to camp. And the hound I left behind made it in about a half hour after us.
. But that was a case where none of those hounds were going to quit. And it almost cost that hound his life.

[Nolte]

Chris
Great stories. I wasn't trying to slight any old dogs that still are productive members of the pack. And like you said on some tracks they are the ones that make it happen. My comment was more directed at hot jumped bear tracks and older dogs. You see dogs that were always in the lead start to fall back during a long run. Or better description would be dogs that were so much ahead of others in every area start to look more normal.

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[pegleg]

Well I don't lead any races anywhere myself. I hope at least I'm still some distance from the grave. Hell might be why I appreciate ol slow steadies game plan more now!
We probably can all agree everything has a physical peak period. Maybe longevity is just as much extending the number of 80% days as over all number .

[al baldwin]

i HAVE OWNED SOME DOGS THAT DID GOOD IN BOBCAT RACES AT TEN PLUS YEARS. The next season at eleven plus they hit a wall & were better left at home. However bear races can be much tougher on old dogs than a cat race, in my experience. Al

[dhostetler]

Both my Walker and bluetick line of dogs live a natural life of 12+ but start going downhill at 10 in speed and toughness. I keep a gallon of water and a dog pan in my rig or ATV when bear hunting on a hard running bear that isn't crossing creeks I try to entercept the dogs to water them mid race but I can very rarely get that done on front dogs as it is very hard to intercept without turning the bear as most times the bear is less than a 100 yards in lead.

[Chris Todd]

I don't bear hunt my hounds. So I am sure that on long fast bear races these older hounds would have a hard time staying in the lead. But I don't bear hunt and could care less about that. What I have seen and learned the last 40-years of lion hunting is that most guys don't know how to utilize the hounds they have. I am bringing 3to4 pups into my pack every year. Call these older hounds pup trainers or what ever you want. They know lion trailing inside and out they are hard working pounding ignore the trash all business lion hounds. Just what young dogs need to learn from. Are they going to live forever of course not. They are 10 plus years are their good days numbered of course they are. I realize that hunting bobcat and hunting lion are two completely different things. The bobcat I have treed have been easy. Short races that any of my hounds could have caught on their own. But I have been on hundreds of lion tracks that have taken every hound I had to catch them. Including some hounds that were over 10-years old.

[kordog]

i will ask a question ,and i hope this doesnt stir the pot too much.how do you think your 10 plus old hounds would stack up against themselves when they were 3to 5 year olds in a race ,and day after day of hunting chris?obviously this is hypathetical question.and just so you know i have never lion hunted in my life.

[Chris Todd]

That is a good question. And hard to answer in some ways. Now in a hard race like I mentioned above. I think these older hounds of mine could hang in there. Would they want to get up and do it again the next day I doubt it. And what you have to realize is that I am talking lion hunting on dry ground. That means dogs making loses and getting a chance to catch their breath. I have been on some fast paced lion chases that went on for hours. I am no bear hunter, but I know chases after bears can be alot faster paced. I believe all three of these hounds have another year in them. By that I mean they can hunt every other day,and contribute. In their younger days they could have been hunted 5-days a week if I needed them to. So are they the hounds they were at 3to5 no their not.

[al baldwin]

I owned one hound who would give it all he had at eleven plus, seldom left him home, trained a couple younger dogs with him at that age. He sure was in a lot of pain the next few days after a hard race. How would he compare to himself when he was in his prime? In his prime, never seen a harder going hound, & had he been hunting with hounds like he was at three to seven years old, those two hounds would have been way behind. However he & those two worked well together & managed to train those two before he hit the wall. Al

[pegleg]

A 3-5 yr old hound is about 16-30 years equivalent . might vary dog to dog etc. But that's were I think they fall. As science says men in good physical training peak at 35 give or take a few. Could I whip my 16 year old self? Yeah pretty easily. Would youths advantages play into it? At a point. But I'd have to guess 24-27 yes old before I would be worried about my younger self. When you look at lifes arc its a much slower decline in men and hounds then the maturing process is. So if I can add six months to my hounds working life I'd like it to be on the experienced dog and not a pup stage.
And while our dogs do slow down as they age some of it is just because they don't need as much effort to do the same job.
When your watching pups and young dogs casting back and forth frantically trying to pick up a loss, and your older dog trails right through. Well yeah they're putting more effort in and covering more ground. Just not really accomplishing more. In a dead sprint race younger dogs can be a bit faster. More endurance maybe. But all houndsmen need more in a dog then just those two traits. Hunting style and everything it could be broadened to include plays a huge role in how we see different dogs. And I bet the truth is if you saw your ten year old hound doing the job you choose for him as good as the younger dogs you might just say it isn't a bad thing. English foxdogs were considered burnt out at 4+ years in many cases. Maybe they were. But I bet most of us would say that's to young.

[kordog]

i knew i stirred the pot to hard now i have pegleg wanting to fight his younger self.lol.i can tell you this 43 year old if i had the chance is not going to go back in time just to get my but kicked by myself which is a certain thing.i would use that time more wisely.sorry pegleg i couldnt resist.

[pegleg]

Lol its OK I'm just as certain I can gauge my own abilities through the years. And I do have to admit a lot has to do with training and improvement. Which hopefully is something our dogs are getting every season too. That being said I can also pinpoint the time I would turn tail and run.
Maybe its how I do it or something else. But its that time of year when all the dogs need exercised and hardened back up. I've been roading them in the cool time's. And due to this thread paying attention to the different age groups. I don't know that physical ability differs a huge amount due to age . but I don't have enough dogs over ten years to compare . but the older ones sure have a better work ethic.