Ageing Tracks

[liontracker]

AZDOGMAN - Nope, at times they sure don't, like when they move in after one of their longwalks.

[Ike]

Went out the first time this year to see if a bear has moved, rigged several lions, one bear that wouldn't move, struck one bobcat on the ground while on a walk and had a good time. Had a guy with me that has buddied and ran dogs for ten or fifteen years but had not been around rig dogs. We got out and found lion tracks on about every rig but didn't get much input about the riggin--guess the guy probably figured that's just what rig dogs do! It snowed Tuesday evening or Wednesday morning and those tracks had moisture in them, were weathered and I would say they had been stormed in. Nevertheless, we tried several of those tracks and I couldn't hardly get my 11 and 9 year old hounds to open on them on the ground after they roared them from the truck Life is good when a guy doesn't have to cut the road and the dogs pick up those old tracks and show me where a lion or bear has crossed!

I wrote these words this morning over under the lion riggin post and got a smart ass remark, and figured I'd move it over here where people are talking about aging tracks and some of you guys may educate me. First off, I'm no Ben Lilly and can not see lion tracks across pine needles, and my theory on aging tracks is a person better be in the general area where that track was put down for longer than the track is old to understand what kind of weather may have effected it.

A couple of the lion tracks we struck were in the same general area which lead me to believe maybe a kill, although there were no birds in the area. The dogs rigged half a dozen lion on this series of tracks and there were different size lion tracks found. Some of the tracks may well have been older than others, but most any of them had damp dirt in the bottom of the track. It did snow three days earlier and I was not in that area, but assume they got a couple inches, all the snow was gone when I was there. There could have been other storms later in the week but like I said, I wasn't there. Every track we found looked weathered plus having the damp bottoms--but the dogs went off pretty well on each and every track. Several of those tracks I put three of my best trail hounds on and walked them down the track for fifty to seventy-five yards and could only get an occasional bark from my most open hound. We called the dogs in and drove on.

On the bear rig, we had driven up that narrow canyon that morning without a bump, yet on the way back down the wind was blowing pretty good off the hillside where the track was--no tracks found on the road. All my hounds went off on this rig and I sent Choco and Kody up the hill. They got up there on a little jeep trail and and began to open, digging, scooping and not going out so I hurried up there to see what the deal was. My hunting buddy and I found a couple sow size bear tracks that had not been dug up by those two rooting hounds looking for tracks, and they looked similar to the lion and had wind, weather and moisture in the bottom of the track. After giving those two hounds ten minutes or so get line out the track we went back to the truck.

Rigged another lion in the road on the hard pan around 10:00 AM, could see the track walking into us from an angle and got out to look. It was an adult female size track, and the lion had came across a natural crossing from a rock face through a small stand of trees and hit the road. We walked that track up our backtracks and could never find it where it left the road, as some of that roadway was pretty hard. I grabbed a couple hounds, put them down and clucked them down the tracks and the dug and scooped but never found where the lion left the road. In my opinion, this was the freshest track of the bunch and had I walked it far enough to find it leaving the road the dogs would have moved it enough to jump and finish it.

The bobcat went up a snow bank while we were walking and all six hounds played with that thing until I made them stop. It was mid-afternoon when they struck that track and was most likely an overnight track. Bobcat is closed and I don't generally let my hounds run them anyway........

ike

[liontracker]

my theory on aging tracks is a person better be in the general area where that track was put down for longer than the track is old to understand what kind of weather may have effected it.

Yep, and that is the only reason I bother to make a track down by the Kennel. On those days when I have to work(LOL) I at least have some sort of a gauge as to what is happening to a track when I am not there.

By the reaction of IKE's dogs on old tracks, it seems obvious that not all old scent hangs low. I would think that part of the aging process is evaporation. I would also think that barometric pressure/temperature determines how high and how fast the scent rises before a gust or thermal carries it off. Maybe under the right conditions and age there is actually more scent built up in the air above the track than on the ground near the track. If what the dogs are striking, is actually vapor molecules in the air, than maybe at a certain age, an old track has more vapor particles in the air than scent molecules on the ground, particularly if the vapor particles are eminating from a more solid source, ie. hair, dander,scat,saliva ect. I would also think, that the height and density of the vegetaion, as well as the slope of the terrain, would determine how long the evaporated scent is hung up at the 6 foot level before it is carried away by the prevailing or thermals. Also, if these are actually vapor phase particles, and heavy ones at that, then they were formed at a certain temperature and pressure. As they rise, the temp and pressure changes and the vapor state changes as well. It would seem probable that these particles would have a tendency to settle again until they encounter their original vaporization stage, and then rise again, therefor creating a low cloud above the ground with a variable ceiling, depending on many conditions.

Poser, where's the aspirin? Definately over thought and my head hurts!

[Ike]

LOL liontracker, and as always a good post with some good food for thought on the deal. I don't have a clue what happens in those situations, and truthfully it doesn't really matter cause it's most likely over my head. I do believe, however, that having a eleven and nine year old hound up since they were pups, hunting with the same man, not mixing them much with others and giving them a chance over the years to show me what they have may well have assisted them in smelling something that most others would miss.

My point is if any of us believe we know more after ten, twenty, thirty, forty or fifty years in this sport then time and experience has contributed to that. Therefore, if it logical to assume that a hound doing the same thing nearly year round for ten years picks up on things that younger dogs don't. I've watched my two six year old hounds move from not touching those same rigs at four to joining in at six years, and those two six year old hounds have been on the box with the two older dogs since they were nine or ten months old.........

ike

[Kevin D]

When my dog strike an old lion track off the rig and I want to age it, I first find the track, cut down the largest sapling growing out of it, then merely count the growth rings. Ain't no science about it......

[Ike]

That sounds like a pretty damn good method kevin, and I'll sharpen my saw and try that next time!

ike

[houndnem]

I was out dry groundin this weekend and had a mind boggling track. A good feller from wyoming came out to try a dog out that he's trying to talk me out of and to see what the buzz is about this dry groundin. we went out in the desert where I had caught a female last week. when we topped the mesa where I have been cutting her the wind was blowing so hard you couldn't see. I decided we would have to go find a deep canyon if we were to have any luck. by the time we got to that canyon it was 8 o'clock and wind was still bad and on top of that it was now raining. wyoming to so. utah is a long way to drive to not hunt so we collared the dogs and started walking. about 9:30 we found a lion track. it had been rained in and was barely visible but I called the dogs over. to my surprise they single file stuck their nose in and blew it up like it was a two hour track in the snow. We followed track for track to keep them honest and by late afternoon they were barkin treed in the ledges. by the time we got there, they had blew over the top and had lost the trail. the wind ontop of that ledge was blowing 60 mph or better. the dogs kept coming back to that spot and going crazy. we never could find the lion, but there's no doubt in my mind that he was there in a crack or a cave somewhere. I guess the thing that amazed me was how they could run that rained in windy as hell track way better than they have ran some better looking tracks in perfect weather? I don't think I'll ever figure this track aging thing out. we did manage to bump a bobber up and they trashed on it and bayed it up. we dragged the dogs to the truck and let it go. I guess on a day like that you're happy for the opertunity to see some type of game caught for your trouble. Anybody got any theories on this track?

[Ike]

I've had tracks that looked pretty good that wouldn't run worth a crap and had others that looked a week old and ran like hell to the tree. Those things always leave a guy guessing and my theory is the wind and rain makes the track look older than it is but only a guess.

A buddy and I had started a brute of a boar black bear years ago off a dead cow in the bottom of a canyon mid to late morning. The hounds were having alot of trouble so we picked them up and drove up the canyon. A few miles later that boar track was found on the road and we were driving along slowly to find where it left. About then it stormed and hailed hard enough ti covered the road, and we were done in my eyes. The hail storm stopped and I put my LionHeart dog down on the road hoping to find where the bear left. She trailed up the road for about a mile then made a hard left near a spring so we threw in eight more dogs. Only three dogs made the tree, and it was a brute of a bear looking down at us, so rained in snowed in and hailed in tracks will run from time to time and a guy just has to try them.......

ike

[doghunter]

I could not stand it and had to chime in I love a good trail dog.

I grew up laying on my dads hood houlding onto the bush bar and tracking. as we got older and I could drive i started dragging the roads. we hunted an area a little over 40 thousand acres with dirt roads. Me and my two brothers would drag one side of the road just after dark and come back at around 4am to start tracking the drag. we would also drag the other side of the road while tracking the other drag made last evening.

at daylight the rest of the hunters would show up and track the new drag on their way in. we usualy had 20 + trucks. we learned how to judge a track pretty good in our area. but we clased them as
fresh (made less that an hour ago)
early last night made after midnight (you needed a trail dog but you would have no trouble jumping)
late last night (made before midnight before the dew set and you need a true trail dog and you may trail half the day because of the distance traveled)
yesterday made before dark the night before. (good luck on this one if you dont have a sure enough trail dog and most people do not want to wait for the amount of time it takes to jump this track)

Anything made before dark the evening before is to much trouble to jump and you should probably try to shorten the run or look for him another day.

i should also add I have a few 5-8 hour nose dogs that will trail a track in the evening they could not trail at noon earlier that day. I guess the sent comes back as the evening cools.

I will also say that anyone that showed up with a dog and said how old a track he could trail could be tested. because after a week of dragging I could give you up to a five day old track to try.

the oldest trail dogs i had would take 24 hrs. they may open on one older but they could not take it to the end.

a number of times just after dark we would spot a good buck while dragging or leaving the woods and mark his track and put on his track at first light the next day. you would usually trail for a half a day or more before you would jump him.

most of the best trail dogs people had would do good if the track was after midnight and after the dew. but if prior they would have trouble. and i cant tell you the number of A #1 trail dogs people brought that would not take a track over 2 hrs.

ageing a track is good knowing your dog is better.

[liontracker]

Anybody got any theories on this track?

I have had similar experiences. I tend to think, that the right amount of rain, followed by the right temperature and pressure, will accelerate the aging (evaporative) process. I think that this has a tendency to "supercharge", for lack of a better word, an older track.