Toms and Females

[Brent Sinclair]

With the use of the new GPS collars there has been some very interesting data unvailed to knock holes in previous theory .
We collared a large tom in early Feb. since that time he has been with two of our collared females ,more interesting , since that time he has not traveled outside of an area much larger than what most of us could walk around in a days hike!!!!
He spent 3 days with the first female and 8 days with the second, these lions are on a 15 minute fix so the collar takes a point four times every hour.
With this ability we can see exactly what they are doing...
They stay right with one and other until the time they seperate and when that occurs they put a bit of distance between themselves.
It was interesting to see just how long that tom stayed with the female.

[liontracker]

Hmmmm...

[sheimer]

Brent, This is interesting to me as we all have been taught that the males went to the females, not visa versa. It makes me wonder what else is just not true. I'm sure that this is not what happens every time, but it's still interesting.

I'm almost positive that this is not the only thing you've learned since starting the study that your doing. Let us know some more cool stuff.

I'm also interested in the collars that your using on the cats. What battery life? How do you download them? What make are they? Are they user friendly? The list goes on and on.....

In reference to a past post with the trail cam pics.....How did you know to put the camera where you did?

Thanks,

Scott

[liontracker]

So Brent, did those females have cubs and if so, then how did they do throughout his visit?

[FullCryHounds]

There a three year study going on here on the front range of CO. right now that is also disproving some past ideas on lions. There's been several kittens die of stavation in an area full of deer, elk and domestic animals to eat. Catching and handling them doesn't seem to bother them, in other words, they stay in the same area and don't change their behavior. One of the Toms has ended up in New Mexico.

[Brent Sinclair]

Brent, This is interesting to me as we all have been taught that the males went to the females, not visa versa. It makes me wonder what else is just not true. I'm sure that this is not what happens every time, but it's still interesting.

I'm almost positive that this is not the only thing you've learned since starting the study that your doing. Let us know some more cool stuff.

I'm also interested in the collars that your using on the cats. What battery life?

These ones are supposed to be good for 52 weeks..

How do you download them?
The Tech's use a unit that picks up the signal from the collar and allows the data collected on the memory within the collar to be transfered to the download unit, then that is uploaded onto a computr program where the points can be transfered to a Google Earth map...
What make are they? Loteck

Are they user friendly? When the collar material is cold they require a few cuss works to get them on other than that they have worked well, very little hair loss or rubbing on those that we have removed.

The list goes on and on.....

In reference to a past post with the trail cam pics.....How did you know to put the camera where you did?
One of our collared females made the kill so when we downloaded her collar it indicated a cluster, the tech's set the camera on that kill and that is when we got the photo's of the other cats.

Thanks,

Scott

[Brent Sinclair]

So Brent, did those females have cubs and if so, then how did they do throughout his visit?

Neither female has kittens....

[Brent Sinclair]

There a three year study going on here on the front range of CO. right now that is also disproving some past ideas on lions. There's been several kittens die of stavation in an area full of deer, elk and domestic animals to eat. Catching and handling them doesn't seem to bother them, in other words, they stay in the same area and don't change their behavior. One of the Toms has ended up in New Mexico.

Dean
Do you think the kitten mortality is caused from the female being killed and the kittens have not reached the ability to hunt on their own?
One comment I read in a study report is 70% of kittens 6 months old can survive on their own, I am going to find that report and quote it on here when I do.
That's as far from true as it gets....
We have caught kittens and they do fine after the female recovers from the immobilization, cats are very resiliant to handling.
Was the tom a young transiant?.. it has been proven that every geographical region where lions inhabit they react different and not only is their habits different is some ways , social structure I believe also had many diferences , it may be very small but they are there.
I believe what is found as in one area of lion habitat is not what can be used to manage data fora population in another.

[liontracker]

So Brent, did those females have cubs and if so, then how did they do throughout his visit?

Neither female has kittens....

Didn't think so. Did the tom kill them?


Our Dow said those collars cost $4,500.00 ea, what do the ones you are using cost?

[Brent Sinclair]

So Brent, did those females have cubs and if so, then how did they do throughout his visit?

Neither female has kittens....

Didn't think so. Did the tom kill them?


Our Dow said those collars cost $4,500.00 ea, what do the ones you are using cost?

When we collared the females there was no indication they had kittens.
One was a female we had in the study for over a yr so we can confirm that.
The other was a new female, we did some snow tracking on her and no kitten sign was ever found.
The Lotek collars run a bit more than that when we get them up here, but that figure is very close.
It's frustrating when you pay that amount for equipment and it has problems with not recording the data it is designed to do or you can not download the data as needed.

[liontracker]

Brent, thanks for keeping up with this one and all the other fine informative posts you make. You know what is truely frustrating, is the fact that the wildlife agencies can spend that kind of money on a collar, actually many of them, and we can barely afford a Garmin, or not!LOL How well do you think those collars would work on a dog?

[dawger]

I have often wondered about some of the so called written in stone lion habits. Such as territory, mating habits, and some of the deer a week theories. I'm no researcher but I have seen some things in those areas of lion lore that would contradict some of the written journals I have read. I think these new sat collars will help a lot with some regional understanding of these cats.

[Mike Leonard]

If you will really read thru the context of this very important thread you will gain a pearl of wisdom that I would say less than 1 lionhunter in 100 understands and it can really change you hunting. I will not give it away because I was challenged for many years to find this clue by a person who had also been challenged by Dale Lee to figure it out.

I will give one small clue and then ya"ll take it from there.


WHO IS THE BEST LION FINDER IN THE WORLD?

[coadycurbow]

Another lion?

[liontracker]

Geez, now that is a tough one...but I would have to say that it is either MikeL looking for a booner tom in NM's unit 2 (as in a needle in a haystack), or a mother lion looking for her cub?

Just kidding. It's friday and I need to get oiled up...it has been awhile.