Walker Dogs

[al baldwin]

Reading on the fox hunting forum, hunter stated the nose had been bred out of the walker dogs, not so in some walkers here in the north west. Tuesday morning seven AM, Tom Hawkins & I collared eight hounds and sent them ahead of the truck searching for cat scent. Better than an hour later after covering a few miles of brushy grown in roads the dogs found a cat scent that only maggie and gunner opened on. Cat had hunted several brushy hog back ridges, dogs worked several directions before maggie found the exit trail & the dogs dropped off a very steep ridge down to a river. Dogs only about four hundred yards away, we stood directly above them but was very hard to hear. Luck was with us, dogs trailed up river, we had a road that took us to a point, allowed us to hear and see the dogs at times as they worked to unravel that feeder track. WOW, those dogs brought that track up a very steep logged unit and came within a few feet of us. Hawk found the scent out the frozen road and things warmed up in a hurry, soon it became a steady roar, cat hunter delight. After about a 15 minute race, bo, tj & maggie were treed solid. After a struggle fighting the brush & terrain we arrived to find them treeing on a maple, clear nothing in that maple. After a long search using bios Tom found the cat about 60 feet up a huge fir that was about ten feet away from the mapel. Did not time this trail job & short race, but it was after noon when T om was skinning the cat. Thanks Tom for a very enjoyable day, your dogs work on that tuesday proved all the nose has not been bred out of the walker dogs. It was very pleasing to witness Kobe your 16 month old walker male working his butt & opening on that track as the track warmed up, you have brought him a long ways from a small pup sleeping in my yard summer before last. Good job. Al

[1bludawg]

That sounds like a good hunt Al.
That cross you made that produced Toms pup may be a good one .I sure like mine.

[mark]

Sounds like a great hunt to me Al,glad to hear you are still out and after em..... im not positive but the way i understand it when those east coast fox and cat hunters talk about walkers they are refering to the running walkers and not the treeing walkers like are so common out here. I may be wrong and hope one of those guys will set me straight.

[julio25]

That does sound like a great hunt. Mark is correct. On this side of the country the running walkers have been bred mostly for the field trial in pens. Running coyotes mostly. The nose and the hunt seems to have bred out. The pen hunters want speed and drive. There is always an exception to the rule, but it is rare. There are still some outside fox and cat hunters that are breeding and raising hounds that have the qualities needed to make true fox dogs. They are vastly outnumbered by the pen hunters breeding for speed and to get their named called at a field trial. Plus stud fees and selling puppies has played a major part in it. That being said, if I find something that is what I call "fox pen bred" and it helps me, I have no problem hunting it. I have never really cared one way or the other about a dog being registered. My dad and granddad always said that a dogs papers have never helped run anything. They do help when it you decide to sell one and with keeping records.

[twist]

Its truely where one looks to find walkers that are breed for cold trailing! They are still out there and with brains and great track speed.

[mark]

Im a little slower than most and not real good at researching things,so would someone please show me the thread where they were talking about Treeing Walkers having the nose bred out of them.

[al baldwin]

Mark I think you are smarter than most of we hunters, your dogs prove it, & besides Blue would not be friends with a slow houndsman. I went back reread that post, still not sure if he talked about only running dogs, he did mention treeing walkers being short on hunt and nose. My question is do they breed the nose out or do they breed out the desire to use the nose? I lean toward they have bred out the desire, my experience has been if give a chance to learn to use their nose, most of the registered walkers have developed about as good a nose as dogs they were hunted with. Now, must say I have given some more time to learn to use their nose than most hunters would have. I sure was not picking on anyone, enjoyed reading Perks post as well as all others who contributed to that thread. When one gets to the place I am in life any hunt is a good one, however most times the brush, view point & cooperation from the critters prevents all hunts being that enjoyable. Maybe, I also need to include some days the dogs just perform better than others. Anyone else ever experience that with your dogs? Al

[dhostetler]

Following are the common widely held views: Walkers are known to be hot nosed & false treerers. Blueticks are known to be slow track straddling track pounders. Plotts are known to be dog aggressive.

I have and am running all 3 breeds and the above is not an accurate description of any of them, however no matter what, those 3 breeds will always be considered as such by people that don't like them.

[Beebout-it]

Al I couldn't agree more that dogs perform better on some days! It's amazing how your dogs can make you the proudest houndsman one day and the very next day leave you scratching your head the whole way home.

[Fisher13]

The nose and track with out a doubt has been bred out and continues to be bred out. Don't think so? Start buying some pups off of the many top coon hound studs with big money won. Most top competition hunters, some of whom are my friend want a dog that gets alone, gets deep and trees the first easy coon it finds. By adding nose or track power to the dog, will cause the dog to take the time to work up a good feeder track, comprising time on the clock. There are still certain lines within the walker breed that still have a cold nose, and exhibit strong qualities, however most breeders are not breeding for those traits. Big game hunters are probably the exception. Hence why I have been attracted to this sport in the past year.

[perk]

Al, sounds like a very enjoyable hunt, glad you got to see good hound work, hear a race, and make a tree. Gotta love it when a plan comes together!
Not sure which post people were putting down treeing walkers on the other thread. I've deer hunted around them and coon hunted around them, never had one I Fox hunted, haven't seen any that exhibit the qualities I want in my pack, better than what I'm already hunting. Have seen them that could trail, jump and drive a coon or deer, but not good enough I wanted to switch my program. I don't know of any guys on east coast running greyfox and cats that use treeing walkers, have talked to a few who tried to run them with their packs to get a tree dog at the end, none of those guys really had success.
Sure there are some lines that are fast, good nose, good build, stamina, and some that are the opposite of all or any of those traits, and it goes for any breed. But I'm sure on the Fox hunting thread that walker was synonymous with American foxhound. Happy hunting
Perk

[Fisher13]

I know of guys running cat and bear with treeing walkers quite a few actually. A litter mate to my female who qualified for chkc as a 1 yr old, cold nose straddler who ran nothing but feeder tracks as a pup. I spoke with a gentleman down in WV who has a full litter mate is a lead bear dog. Typically there skuna river of clover bred, house would be an older one. Also have a friend who's best cat dog is a beagle x treeing walker.

[perk]

Fisher13,
I'm sure there are tons of guys here in the east running bear with treeing walkers, and being successful. I'm sure in some of the more mountainous regions they are running cats will the same dogs. Surely there are top dogs with excellent qualities in all breeds. I know of a boy who has caught bobcat with a pack of rabbit beagles, and know a boy who has had his packbeagles/walker (foxhound, remember I'm east coast bred here)deer dogs catch and kill coyote.
I will again reiterate all the boys in the fox hound threads from back east or south east walker generally is synonymous with American foxhound.
Finding guys who have a treeing walker in their pack of dogs who catch Fox/bobcat fairly consistently or have a chance too, here or south of me. Well that Is as tough as finding a guy out west using all straight running dogs!
Don't wanna end up in an argument. Just wanted to clarify to all readers south east the term 'walker' means Foxhound... I personally us the term 'tree stock' if I'm talking about a TW so those around me know I don't mean foxhound

[undertheradar]

^^^^YUP^^^^