Harvest ejective in Utah!

[pegleg]

I hound hunt because you don't have to kill to be successful. ever went home from a deer or elk hunt with out one and bragged how well you did? not likely!! here's a easy method leave the gun in the truck if once you get to the tree it's worth walking back out to the truck and back to harvest then do it and give your "buddies" the same rule. I know I've passed on nice elk because I didn't want to pack it through the rough. if you truly work for something it gets higher in personal value anyway. as far as guides they don't get paid for a nice hike or no kill. so do the math. I tree as many cats as some outfitters but there damn sure aren't as many killed over my hounds. I have not filled tags because treeing them is my thrill. once you shoot you have to pack it out skin it and pay the taxidermist otherwise you go home relax and get up and do it again in the morning. just my point of view. and since I don't hunt utah it's just ramblings

[Ike]

as far as guides they don't get paid for a nice hike or no kill. so do the math. I tree as many cats as some outfitters but there damn sure aren't as many killed over my hounds. I have not filled tags because treeing them is my thrill. once you shoot you have to pack it out skin it and pay the taxidermist otherwise you go home relax and get up and do it again in the morning. just my point of view. and since I don't hunt utah it's just ramblings

Contrary to popular belief, a hunter pays before they get into a guide's truck with my outfitter--not for the kill but for the hunt! It cost more to hunt a trophy hunter than a person just wanting to kill. Last fall I rigged and drove past thirty-five to forty bears for a client looking for Mr. Right and probably put in 1500 to 1800 miles doing it, yet the hunt would have paid the same to kill a sow the first day. That hunter complimented me after the hunt by saying I was the hardest working guide that he'd ever hunted with--and that man does some guiding.

Another bear hunter i had walked away from a four-year old type boar that probably weighed over 260 pounds, then had a chance to kill him during the late season. That boar was chocolate and was better than lots of people take in this state, yet he told me to drive on. We talked about that bear and the hunter told me, "if I can't kill one of those 400 pound monsters I don't want a bear. We got behind three or four of those bears but never fresh enough to finish one. This guy was a friend and I donated extra days trying to make it happen for him--so it isn't always about money.

I never sugar coat a lion or bear hunt--matter fact I never sugar coat anything. If a person plays by the rules, running down and killing a trophy tom lion or big boar is tough duty in Utah because of the time, distance and population limits where I hunt, plus it requires a little luck as for getting a quality track with some degree of freshness. I agree it's usually better to walk away for the hunter or guide because of taxidermist issues--plus it's just easier to leave them in the tree. However, if sportsmen don't take some of the lions and bears the state will just pay out money for ADC to take them (monies they collected from us). And if the hunters are paying for the whole deal they might as well take the harvest if they are happy with that animal. I've never pushed anybody to shoot whether it was a big bear or lion, but rather attempted to tell them what I thought the animal was and leave the decision to them.......

ike

[houndnem]

seems to me everybody is dodging the bullet here. most of the lions that get killed are the ones that the d.n.r. issue tags for. so why do they allow so many to be killed?

[Ike]

That's and easy one, deer herd populations have been low for a number of years and deer hunting brings in more money than lion hunting does--or ever will. Then there is a critter called the bighorn sheep which needs protection from the mountain lion. It would be really neat if our deer herds ever recovered to historical (or even approved numbers) levels which would feed a larger mountain lion population, but good luck on that one as well.......

ike

[houndnem]

Ike, do you personally think that reducing lion populations really helps the deer that much? I noticed where I hunt deer that when the deer are at their highest number and quality so are the lion populations. when the deer are dying off and doing poor so are the lions. If they were that concerned about their precious little deer they would fence off some of these hightways that kill thousands of deer a year!!!!! I see it every weekend when I drive back to circleville from st. george. deer laying everywhere.at least when a lion kills them they eat the bastards. garrantied the highway kills more than the cats. you follow these cats as much as I do and for more years, you know they don't just eat deer. turkeys rabbits lots of elk etc. I don't think they affect the deer herd as much as dnr says!what say you?

[Ike]

Ike, do you personally think that reducing lion populations really helps the deer that much?

I was giving their motivation or reasoning for lion removal not mine. As far as I'm concerned, DWR could shut down the deer hunt for a few years and let the lions come back but that won't happen. Lions do impact deer herds, but so do black bear, coyotes and possibly golden eagles to some degree with the young. But coyotes are far worse than any, as they rip those young yearlings apart all summer long and throughout the winter months. Other mountain lions also have an impact on the lion population, as recent evidence in Utah shows a young tom lion killed by an older lion.

I don't disagree with you about fencing or other measure to help save deer, but for whatever reasons the state has been slow to do that. Fact is, I'd like to se a real figure on how many deer get killed by vehicles each year in this state--I think the numbers it stagger a guy. I haven't taken a deer myself since 1998, so I know I'm not the problem.......

keep'em treed,
ike

[houndnem]

Thanks for the input Ike. maybe someday they'll figure it out. I guess until then it's up to us to exercise self controll.