cougar,bobcat scent alike?

southwestwalkers · Post by **southwestwalkers** » Sat Jul 21, 2007 12:14 pm

just wondering if there is a big differance between to two scents. Im training my hound on lion scent and down the road bobcat just wondering if they are close in smell?

Thanks, Robb

treeing walkers · Post by **treeing walkers** » Sat Jul 21, 2007 12:56 pm

I don't know if the actual scent is different but the smell of the two is completely different too me. but if ur dogs will run bobs then they will for sure run a lion as they leave a stronger scent trail and they are easy for the dogs to catch once they catch up to it.

southwestwalkers · Post by **southwestwalkers** » Sat Jul 21, 2007 1:16 pm

treeing walkers...

Thanks for the info. Im training on the lion scent first then the bobcat. I may start switching every other day... Are your saying its harder to locate a bobcat than a cougar....
Robb

treeing walkers · Post by **treeing walkers** » Sat Jul 21, 2007 1:29 pm

by far in my experience lions are alot easier for the dog to run about like a coon race pretty quick once they catch up to it. A lion can't run very far at top speed. 100-200yds ??? Bobcats can run for a long time once the dogs catch up and they are smart and got some speed behind them and small enough they don't leave much of a scent trail. both lion and bobs could be hard for a dog to locate in a tree as they both can jump vertically in a tree pretty high up. But I think the lion would be the easiest. JMO

whoflungdung · Post by **whoflungdung** » Sun Jul 22, 2007 11:18 pm

by far in my experience lions are a lot easier for the dog to run about like a coon race pretty quick once they catch up to it. A lion can't run very far at top speed. 100-200yds ??? Bobcats can run for a long time once the dogs catch up and they are smart and got some speed behind them and small enough they don't leave much of a scent trail. both lion and bobs could be hard for a dog to locate in a tree as they both can jump vertically in a tree pretty high up. But I think the lion would be the easiest. JMO

Yep. Been my experience to.

I have heard dogs can tell the difference and there are people that brake there dogs off one or the other. I want mine to run both

southwestwalkers · Post by **southwestwalkers** » Tue Jul 24, 2007 4:24 pm

yeah...teachin my hound on both cats. I never figured that on the lion. Easier to run.....looking at it that way I agree.

Easier to locate a lion than a bob... guess it could depend where your runnin them

Gary Roberson · Post by **Gary Roberson** » Wed Jul 25, 2007 11:26 am

treeing walker. You are correct that the two scents do not have the same odor. I have a buddy, Robby Hurt who has the straightest bobcat hounds that I have ever seen and catches 160 to 170 bobcats annually. Last deer season, a deer hunter called him and told him that he had crippled a lion. Robby loaded three of his best hounds, one being a dog that doubled as a recovery dog on wounded deer (blood trailer). The only dog that would trail the bleeding lion was the blood trailing dog. The others would not open. The blood trailing dog treed the cat and the other two hounds were under the tree but would not say anything. Finally after quite a bit of hissing, the two top bobcat hounds barked a little. Rob tied the dogs back and jumped it out they went a couple hundred yards and treed again. On the race, all of the hounds opened and treed. He caught another crippled lion later in the season and the two hounds trailed and treed. This proves that if your hounds are truly broke on bobcats, they may not open on a lion.

houndsnmules · Post by **houndsnmules** » Thu Jul 26, 2007 8:46 pm

I believe lion and bobcats do have some similarity in their respective smells.So a hound not broke off one or the other would run both with no problem. Hounds can scent particles in parts per million so they definitely can tell the difference if they want to.

Gary Roberson · Post by **Gary Roberson** » Sat Jul 28, 2007 3:30 pm

houndsnmules, I agree with you. I was just amazed how broke a set of hounds could be to open on nothing but a bobcat.

Mike Leonard · Post by **Mike Leonard** » Sat Jul 28, 2007 11:00 pm

It has been my expereince that most hounds that will run a lion will try to run a bobcat if the trail is fresh enough. Most of them don't show a lot of intrest if they haven't been worked on bobs a pretty good bunch. Straight bobcat dogs however at times have to be hard broke off other game, and that means coyote, fox, coon,deer, and such. There are just so many things out there that leave more scent than a bobcat. Do not just assume that since you have doped up a a coon or barn lion with cougar scent and they have trailed it that they will turn in a good show on Mr. bobcat.

Get the best bobcat scent availabe ( Grawes Animals Scents). and work them enough to get them familiar with the scent and eager for it, but not so much you turn them into circle running idiots. Then take them to the woods, find the freshest bobcat traack you can and help them, cross your fingers and if lady luck smiles on you you may come up with a cat dog. If not don't worry too much about him following lion scent he will , and you won't even have to buy another bottle.

I can't stress this enough: do not over work your young dogs on training critters. Use them sparingly and just enough to get the idea across and then go hunting. We have a whole lot of yards and dog jockies places full of pro- team ditch lion dogs that can't catch cold when it comes to real hunting. don't let fun or ego allow you to mess up a fine young prospect. GO HUNTING

treeing walkers · Post by **treeing walkers** » Sun Jul 29, 2007 12:46 am

There is the advice we all so miss THANKS MIKE

Randy & Tracie Hill · Post by **Randy & Tracie Hill** » Tue Jul 31, 2007 9:10 am

I agree with Mr.Mike, 100% on this one... There is NO substitute for the real thing and too much "Set Up" training is never a good thing.

As to the scent ? in my limited experiance you can get the every so often dog that will excell in running both lions and stubbies but sadly they are rare as hens teeth.
Most times I wind up with (as in my case) Bobcat Dogs that will tree the ocassional Lion but I think thats more of a geographical thing for me anyway, though I do have one now and have fed them in the past that would do either better than average....... but they are rare.

Randy

southwestwalkers · Post by **southwestwalkers** » Tue Jul 31, 2007 2:42 pm

thanks for the info folks....

Bearkiller · Post by **Bearkiller** » Fri Aug 10, 2007 8:23 pm

Gary Roberson wrote:treeing walker. You are correct that the two scents do not have the same odor. I have a buddy, Robby Hurt who has the straightest bobcat hounds that I have ever seen and catches 160 to 170 bobcats annually. Last deer season, a deer hunter called him and told him that he had crippled a lion. Robby loaded three of his best hounds, one being a dog that doubled as a recovery dog on wounded deer (blood trailer). The only dog that would trail the bleeding lion was the blood trailing dog. The others would not open. The blood trailing dog treed the cat and the other two hounds were under the tree but would not say anything. Finally after quite a bit of hissing, the two top bobcat hounds barked a little. Rob tied the dogs back and jumped it out they went a couple hundred yards and treed again. On the race, all of the hounds opened and treed. He caught another crippled lion later in the season and the two hounds trailed and treed. This proves that if your hounds are truly broke on bobcats, they may not open on a lion.

Where does your buddy live? I'd like to meet him some day. That man is catching basicly a bobcat every other day if he's hunting every day of the year. With the occasional 2 days in between cats. Thats a TON of cats. I bet he's gonna run out of cats soon though catching that many. Do you know how many of those are on the ground? Like say 25% +/- ? Maybe higher? Ya'll must have a year round season. Where is it? I'd like to go see the dogs that are catching that many bobcats in the summer.

Gary Roberson · Post by **Gary Roberson** » Mon Aug 13, 2007 8:37 pm

Bearkiller, there is no bag limit and no closed season here and we hunt year round. We are somewhat limited by the heat and deer season because of the hunters that are paying a lot of money to hunt these private ranches. Unless you have been to this country (south of San Antonio to the Rio Grande) it is difficult to imagine how much brush and prickly pear there can be. It is also home to the largest population of bobcat and coyote that I have ever seen. This buddy of mine lives approx. 100 miles SW of San Antonio toward Laredo. He ranches for a living and hunts everyday that he wants to. He has access to thousands of acres of private ranchland. I have been with him when we caught 3 bobcats in one evening. I was staying on the ranch where he was hunting last spring, he went bobcat hunting and I was filming a coyote hunt. He hunted all day and caught 7 bobcats with his hounds. Approx. 1/2 of the cats are caught on the ground and the remainder will tree. He hunts primarily running walker hounds some are crossed up with other hound breeds. The best hound I ever saw him hunt was half bluetick and running walker. He had a better nose than most running dogs and was tough...had a lot of stamina.
I know what you mean about catching all of the cats out of an area and I did that as a kid on my home ranch. Robbie has more country than he can hunt out so it has not been a problem.